Reformed1689
Well-Known Member
If kids cannot understand and speak until they are six there is something mentally/developmentally wrong with them.
you know kids under 6 who can understand and SPEAK??? WHAT are you on!!!
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Are Human Beings Born Sinners?
- Thread starter SavedByGrace
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SavedByGrace
Well-Known Member
6 months I mean
37818
Well-Known Member
How is your view not Pelagian? Do babies have a sinful nature in your view? Psalms 58:3?
Reformed1689
Well-Known Member
Even still. Answer this ONE thing directly.
You seem to think that if someone does not know the difference between good/evil it means they cannot be sinning even if they do something wrong. Is that correct?
If I have read that correctly, please respond to the following:
Since Adam and Eve did not have knowledge of Good and Evil, how were they able to sin in the Garden?
SavedByGrace
Well-Known Member
My question is why does the Bible actually specify in the verses I mentioned in the OP about not knowing about right and wrong if they mean nothing?
SavedByGrace
Well-Known Member
So a baby of a day old speaks lies literally? Or is this verse language not to be seen literally
SavedByGrace
Well-Known Member
Adam and Eve like all humans had a sinful nature. Which enabled them to sin
Reformed1689
Well-Known Member
Well let's look at that. First, the Deuteronomy passage was for a very specific people for a very specific purpose and regarding a specific sin. The children were not punished for the sin of the parents. So it really has no actually applicability to the overall topic.
In Isaiah, it is literally just showing about a young boy before he reaches an age of understanding something will happen. That has nothing to do with whether or not a child of that age can commit sin.
The passage in Jonah, again, literally has nothing to do with whether or not someone can commit sin.
The Romans passage is about the unborn and therefore irrelevant.
Now, you have avoided my question about Adam and Eve about 10 times at this point. Why can't you answer that simple question?
Reformed1689
Well-Known Member
They had a sinful nature before their sin? Really? Before they knew good and evil? Are you sure? So before they sinned they were separated from God? No sir. You are not getting any of this from Scripture and now are in panic mode trying to say anything to help you because your point has crumbled by the truth.
SavedByGrace
Well-Known Member
If they didn't have natures that could sin then how could they have sinned
Reformed1689
Well-Known Member
So they were already condemned from the start? Is that what you are saying? Almost as if it were ordained that they would sin?
Are you saying that God will not view their acts as sins then ?
They had sinless natures though UNTIL they sinned, not like any of us here!
Ask Lucifier that!
That sounds very high calvinist there!
SavedByGrace
Well-Known Member
how was the devil able to tempt a perfect sinless nature, and cause them to fall? There must have been something in Adam and Eve before the "fall", that caused them to rebel against God. I don't have the answer here, but these are my thoughts?
The sinned same reason satan fell, both decided that they wanted to "play God"
Reformed1689
Well-Known Member
So is God the author of sin?
SavedByGrace
Well-Known Member
Sinful natures do not mean that they were "sinners" already, but that they could, and did sin against God. How it was done is not mentioned in the Bible. It is rather strange that the devil, a created being, was able to cause a perfect, sinless human to sin against the God of the Bible? This indeed is a mystery to me!
Reformed1689
Well-Known Member
Aren't you a champion of free will? Equal choice between two choices?
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