Are their current forum members who would like to discuss the Sabbath?

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

I cannot believe nobody would be interested or care, because the Sabbath is integral and essential of Christian Faith, in Christian Faith and to, Christian Faith.

Because the Sabbath is Scriptural - New-Testament 'Scriptural'.

Because the Sabbath is indispensible "for the People of God" to be, The People of God.

Because the Sabbath originates from and is based on the work of Jesus Christ for redemption; it is the Lord's Day for the Lordship of its Lord by Resurrection from the dead, "On the Sabbath" Mt28:1.


HOW DO I EDIT THE THREAD-TITLE? ERRATUM: "their" should be "there", please. Thanks. GE

 

[ReformedBaptist]

I would discuss it. You can see in my sig my creed. The part on the sabbath is one of the few things I disagree with at the moment, but I am open to learning from the Scripture.

 

[billwald]

The Sabbath is NOT the Lord's Day and even if it was . . . during the winter most churches would be having their Sabbath evening services on Monday.

 

[sag38]

No one wants to be called out like you used to do Ed all the time.

 

[Joseph M. Smith]

I am willing to discuss such things as how to let the sabbath experience shape our lives, how rest is important to us, how to structure worship and reflection. I am not willing to get into debates about the day or the time. That is not central to a relational interpretation of the Bible.

 

[annsni]

I am willing to discuss such things as how to let the sabbath experience shape our lives, how rest is important to us, how to structure worship and reflection. I am not willing to get into debates about the day or the time. That is not central to a interpretation of the Bible.

Amen!! :applause:

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

Well, many thanks for the civilized responses. I know I am the one who is going to need most grace to stay civilized. I shall try, but need your help. Your help will be to stay to the topic and to stay with the Scriptures.

Now the response I liked best was that of ReformedBaptist. I guess you all would have guessed, seeing I'm obviously not forgotten on this forum yet. I'm even remembered by one for the discussions between me and Ed Sutton. I think that will do for illustration of what I mean with being off the topic, unless such cross-references are specifically about instances of the use of some Scripture or Scriptures about the Sabbath (or Sunday).

Then another response clearly illustrates the arbitrary and assertive 'arguments' that simply make assumptions based on assumptions, Like, the Sabbath is not the Lord's Day without any Scripture whatsoever.

A last category not to my liking is the morality response which concerns itself with subjective feelings and more often than not llusions concerning man and his keeping of the Sabbath. What does our keeping or dreams about some etherial 'rest-sabbath' have to do with the subject-matter under discussion - what, with what the Scriptures have to say about God and the deeds of God with bearing on the Sabbath Day? And here I have the redemptive Acts of God in mind. This is not a discussion about if there is a God or if He is the Creator; these things are accepted before anything else. What is soteriological about the Sabbath; and what is eschatological about the Sabbath --- these are the sort of thing I have in mind (with your permission).

I would like to go on with the discussion by confessing my faith in an unchangeble God, who has ever been true to His Word and His Eternal Purpose and Promise through Jesus Christ and in Jesus Christ. That for me rules out any possibility anything our Faithful God has done would nullify his one and only Word which is identically Himself.

So, how can Sunday replace the Sabbath? What about God's faithfulness to Himself first and to his People next?

 

[billwald]

Sundays were much more peaceful when we had Sunday closing laws. I think a reintroduction of them would go a long way to solve the medical cost issue.

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

I am willing to discuss such things as how to let the sabbath experience shape our lives, how rest is important to us, how to structure worship and reflection. I am not willing to get into debates about the day or the time. That is not central to a relational interpretation of the Bible.

GE:
"not central to a relational interpretation of the Bible"? A "relational interpretation of the Bible"?

These are strange concepts for me. Please explain?

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

Sundays were much more peaceful when we had Sunday closing laws. I think a reintroduction of them would go a long way to solve the medical cost issue.

GE:
And fill the already overcrowded prisons even more ....

 

[Joseph M. Smith]

GE:
"not central to a relational interpretation of the Bible"? A "relational interpretation of the Bible"?

These are strange concepts for me. Please explain?

I suspect that I am one of those to whom you are referring when you speak of those who want to refer to Sabbath and "feelings" and rest, etc.

What I mean is that I do not read the Bible so much as a collection of precepts, moral absolutes, and laws as I read it first as the record of God's ongoing work of redemption, and second (but closely related) as insight into the human condition and how our estrangement from God and one another is played out in history. Thus a relational interpretation of the Bible ... not one focused on scientific accuracy or historical factuality, but on the heart of God for His creation.

 

[Revmitchell]

I suspect that I am one of those to whom you are referring when you speak of those who want to refer to Sabbath and "feelings" and rest, etc.

What I mean is that I do not read the Bible so much as a collection of precepts, moral absolutes, and laws as I read it first as the record of God's ongoing work of redemption, and second (but closely related) as insight into the human condition and how our estrangement from God and one another is played out in history. Thus a relational interpretation of the Bible ... not one focused on scientific accuracy or historical factuality, but on the heart of God for His creation.

Interesting......how do you come to the conclusion that knowing the heart of God can be understood in "factual" terms?

 

[Alcott]

No relevance-- Romans 14:5,6; Colossians 2:16.

 

[billwald]

Didn't St Paul teach that the day of the week one selected for worship was immaterial?

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

Billwald, here is something from a fellow South African - a medical doctor and devout Roman Catholic ....

"In reading the New Testament, we find that Jesus and his inspired apostles taught all the commandments of the Decalog, with the exception of the fourth commandment, the Sabbath law. There is no command in the covenant of Christ for any man to keep the Sabbath. The only day given special recognition in the new covenant is the first day of the week, commonly called Sunday, referred to in the scriptures as the Lord's Day. This day is not the Christians' Sabbath, as some assert. The Sabbath, whenever mentioned in the scriptures, always without exception, designates the seventh day of the week. Nowhere in the Bible is it affirmed that the first day of the week is given in place of the Sabbath. It is part of the new covenant and with a new significance, the day which our blessed Lord was raised from death according to Mark 16: 9. It is the day according to the examples the Lord's followers are to break bread, to Only a few years after the death of the last "But Sunday is the day which we hold our set forth in Acts 20: 7, that the Lord's followers are to break bread, partake of the Lord's supper. Only a few years after the death of the Apostle, Justin Martyr wrote, "But Sunday is the day which we hold our common assembly, because it is the first day of the week, and Jesus our Saviour on the same day rose from the dead". "

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

Interesting......how do you come to the conclusion that knowing the heart of God can be understood in "factual" terms?

GE:
I would say the nearest one could get to that, is by the Scriptures. It is faith in the Scriptures that to me is 'faith'; then after we believed the Scriptures, we begin to pay attention to the facts of the Scriptures which include 'feeling', 'exprerience' etc. I distrust most my own feelings and experience and relationship for 'fact' or 'factual'.

 

[Carico]

If you really want to discuss the Sabbath then you first need to read Hebrews 4:1-9 to see that the Sabbath is no longer a day of the week any more than the day of atonement is a day in the month or year. Jesus fulfilled the whole law including the Sabbath law. So let's see if anyone here knows what and who the Sabbath really is. Any takers?

 

[BobRyan]

I am willing to discuss such things as how to let the sabbath experience shape our lives, how rest is important to us, how to structure worship and reflection. I am not willing to get into debates about the day or the time. That is not central to a relational interpretation of the Bible.

In Rev 14 the saints are identified as those who "keep the commandments".

In 1Cor 7:19 Paul says "but what matters is keeping the commandments".

In Rom 3:31 Paul says that our faith "Establishes the Law"

In James 2 -- James says that we ARE to be judged by the ten commandment law of God.

So while there are many views on this topic -- one thing is for sure --- there is no lack in scripture of Bible authors saying that it is a significant subject for Christians.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[BobRyan]

If you really want to discuss the Sabbath then you first need to read Hebrews 4:1-9 to see that the Sabbath is no longer a day of the week any more than the day of atonement is a day in the month or year. Jesus fulfilled the whole law including the Sabbath law. So let's see if anyone here knows what and who the Sabbath really is. Any takers?

Since Heb 4 says "THERE REMAINS therefore a Sabbath rest for the people of God" -- and since you have not actually quoted anything from Heb 4 in your post to make your case... Tell us how you do it.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[Johnv]

Since Heb 4 says "THERE REMAINS therefore a Sabbath rest for the people of God" ...

Do people actually read whole passages of scripture these days, or do they just lift verses to suit their needs?

Heb4 isn't referring to a day of the week that is to be observed. The phrase "Sabbath rest" here is an analogy. It's referring to believers entering into the arms of Christ, which it referrs to as their Sabbath rest.