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Featured Belief not a gift

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Revmitchell, Feb 16, 2022.

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  1. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    Because you are trying to show that God only has mercy on the elect and hardens the rest, which is anti Biblical and an insult to Death of Jesus Christ
     
  2. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    I am quite sure your question is sincere but it is odd. One does not lead to the other. However, I have stated clearly that I believe God sends someone to preach the gospel. The gospel does the internal work at that point (Hebrews 4:12) and God regenerates after belief. The word of God produces belief (Romans 10:17).
     
  3. RipponRedeaux

    RipponRedeaux Well-Known Member

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    "Therefore God has mercy on whom he wants to have mercy, and he hardens whom he wants to harden." (Romans 9:18)
     
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  4. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    Why do you ignore 11.32???
     
  5. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    I am going to need you to be more specific than just the chapter. Which verses specifically?
     
  6. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    God has elected a multitude of dead sinners. Eph 2 explains part of the saving and regenerating grace that is effectual.
    Jesus explained the unseen work of the Spirit
    In Jn3.3-12
     
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  7. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    The whole Bible does not reach this. It is reformed theology
     
  8. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Repeating deflection is simply obfuscation. You and Calvinism have no answer to why a person unable to accept God's revelation makes God a liar. They took no action.

    I did not claim God is not righteous, I claimed the idea that all the lost are unable to comprehend God's revelation is unbiblical nonsense.

    God credits the beliefs of some and places them into Christ. This is the fundamental truth of the gospel being denied.

    Every verse that proclaims this truth is said not to mean what it says. 2 Thessalonians 2:13, James 2:5, Romans 4:23-24.
    Every verse that says "through faith" is claimed by Calvinism to mean "not through faith" but saved then given faith.
    Every verse that says "his faith" or "your faith" does not mean what it says, it means 'his God instilled faith" and "your God instilled faith.

    The list is large and compelling.
     
  9. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    The Bible does not teach Eph.1-4???
    You who were deadee, even as others,
    But God who is rich in Mercy...says that in every Bible.
    you say the Apostles taught reformed theology here in Eph.2.
    I agree.That is why and the others believe it!
     
  10. RipponRedeaux

    RipponRedeaux Well-Known Member

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    What do you do with Romans 9:18? Is it true or not? Scripture does not contradict Scripture. Does God grant mercy to every single human being -- past present and future? Obviously not. He has his elect ones who were elected before the world was formed. His elect are from every, nation, tribe, language and people --scattered across the globe both Jews and Gentiles.

    Look at Galatians 3:22 "But Scripture has locked up everything under the control of sin, so that what was promised, being given through faith in Jesus Christ, might be given to those who believe."

    So everyone left to their sinful natures are caught in a prison of sorts. Their sin is so offensive to God that every single person would be eternally condemned. Therefore, if anyone Gentile or Jew is going to be saved it rests solely on God's mercy. "So that he might have mercy on them all" (Romans 11:32) means all without distinction --not without exception. Otherwise all would be saved. But all who are saved are saved by mercy --by grace alone.
     
  11. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    And John 3.16 tells us MORE about God's Rich Love for the entire human race :D
     
  12. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    yes it does.God lovedHis children worldwide.
    In jn3...they are described as everyone believing and continuing on in a state of believing.
    The same processPaul taught in Eph 2.which you descibed as reformed theology happens to each and every elect sheep.
     
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  13. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    yes it does.God lovedHis children worldwide.
    In jn3...they are described as everyone believing and continuing on in a state of believing.
    The same processPaul taught in Eph 2.which you descibed as reformed
     
  14. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    here is your error in understanding what 11:32 says, in the Greek Paul writes, "ἐλεήσῃ", which is in the subjunctive mood, "MIGHT have Mercy". This "mood" is "conditional", because the sinner must first "repent and believe in the Gospel" about Jesus Christ, BEFORE they can get saved. This verse in the context, does not say that God WILL have Mercy on the ALL.

    Further, this is proved from the previous sentence in this verse, "For God has consigned all to disobedience". Are you saying that the ALL here is only the "elect", which of course must mean, that the "non-elect" have not been so "consigned" by God, which is absurd! BOTH the Jews and Gentiles, which is the entire human race, as you were either one of the two, are included in the ALL upon whom God MIGHT have Mercy!
     
  15. Reformed1689

    Reformed1689 Well-Known Member

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    Let's start with verses 35-51
     
  16. Reformed1689

    Reformed1689 Well-Known Member

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    Take it up with Scripture, it says he does in fact do just that.
     
  17. Reformed1689

    Reformed1689 Well-Known Member

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    Says the king of non answers....
     
  18. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    The use of Kosmos here in 3:16, cannot mean the "elect", because we are told that the "whoever believes" OUR OF this WORLD, used here, will be saved. This means that there are SOME out of this ELECT WORLD, if we so understand it, will not be saved! The reformed theologian, Robert Dabney said that it was ABRURD to take WORLD here to mean ELECT, and he is 100% RIGHT. John Calvin says that it means, "everyone without exception"!

    There you have it, IF you are willing to accept what the Bible says!
     
  19. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    did you know, when Jesus says, "So the last shall be first, and the first last: for many be called, but few chosen" (Matthew 20:26), that the Greek adjective, κλητός, means "INVITED"? Does this indicate to you DRAG or FORCE?

    You are the one who is FORCING your own theology on the Word of God, and you will always FAIL!
     
  20. Reformed1689

    Reformed1689 Well-Known Member

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    Please cite references.
     
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