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Biblical Chastening

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Brother Bob

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When a person becomes saved he doesn't get a licence to sin. In fact sin becomes even more abhorrent to him. Is that such a hard concept to understand?__________________
DHK
I believe this but I don't think you do for you say, after salvation that the saved can commit ever sin known to man.

Originally Posted by Brother Bob
My veiw on God is that He cannot lie? You believe when God says "never to be remember against you anymore" does not really mean that, but means every time you commit sin, you will have to confess your sin and have Jesus "plead" your case. Why would He have to "plead your case", if it was already forgiven. I have learned how the "Mega" churches fill their house now.
I am sorry if you refuse to accept figurative expressions, even though I have given you many examples. Perhaps you had better bury the hatchet.

2Pe 1:20Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.

No, I accept scripture though.
 

2 Timothy2:1-4

New Member
Romans10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.


John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:


Goodness more works based salvation what shall we do?
 

DHK

<b>Moderator</b>
Brother Bob said:
I believe this but I don't think you do for you say, after salvation that the saved can commit ever sin known to man.
This is why you can't explain 1John 2:1 "If any man sin..."
It defeats your theology.
2Pe 1:20Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.

No, I accept scripture though.

Psalms 36:7 How excellent is thy lovingkindness, O God! therefore the children of men put their trust under the shadow of thy wings.
--Will you explain this one for me Bob.
 

James_Newman

New Member
TCGreek said:
What does this question have to do with Paul's statement "By grace you are saved through faith."?

If 'through faith' means exercise faith, what do you have to do to exercise faith and be saved?
 

Brother Bob

New Member
Originally Posted by Brother Bob
I believe this but I don't think you do for you say, after salvation that the saved can commit ever sin known to man.
This is why you can't explain 1John 2:1 "If any man sin..."
It defeats your theology.
This is why you can't explain 1John

1Jo 3:8He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.


1Jo 3:9Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

Are you of the Devil DHK:??

Psalms 36:7 How excellent is thy lovingkindness, O God! therefore the children of men put their trust under the shadow of thy wings.
--Will you explain this one for me Bob.
__________________
DHK
You lost me on this one DHK:. What is your point? Where else could we put our trust and it not fail?
 

TCGreek

New Member
James_Newman said:
If 'through faith' means exercise faith, what do you have to do to exercise faith and be saved?

1. James, "Believe on", "Faith in", "exercise faith" all mean the same thing.

2. If you think either one involves works, then you are on your own.
 
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DHK

<b>Moderator</b>
Brother Bob said:
You lost me on this one DHK:. What is your point? Where else could we put our trust and it not fail?
You want to take some figures of speech literally:
He remembers them no more.
He hides them behind his back.
He casts them into the deepest sea.

All of the above have to do with our sins. You want to take the word "remember" literally, taking away from God's omniscience.

But when I show you some other obvious figures of speech you admit that there is no other way to understand the verse except to admit that it is a figure of speech for we all know that God is spirit, a spirit has not wings.
 

James_Newman

New Member
TCGreek said:
1. James, "Believe on", "Faith in", "exercise faith" all mean the same thing.

2. If you think either one involves works, then you are on your own.

Prove this from scripture. Exercise faith means to do something based on your faith. You exercise faith when you get on your knees and pray to God because you believe that He hears you. Noah exercised faith when he built the ark because he believed God was going to send a flood. Thats what James was talking about when he said faith without works is dead being alone. That is faith that is not exercised.
 

DHK

<b>Moderator</b>
Brother Bob said:
This is why you can't explain 1John

1Jo 3:8He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.


1Jo 3:9Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

Are you of the Devil DHK:??
1. As I expected you still cannot explain 1John 2:1.
2. To infer that I am of the devil is the lowest form of debate. It only shows that you have no answers. You have lost your own debate. And furthermore you have posted against the BB rules.
 

Brother Bob

New Member
But when I show you some other obvious figures of speech you admit that there is no other way to understand the verse except to admit that it is a figure of speech for we all know that God is spirit, a spirit has not wings.__________________
DHK
You ever see one?
 

Brother Bob

New Member
Originally Posted by Brother Bob
This is why you can't explain 1John

1Jo 3:8He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.


1Jo 3:9Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

Are you of the Devil DHK:??
1. As I expected you still cannot explain 1John 2:1.
2. To infer that I am of the devil is the lowest form of debate. It only shows that you have no answers. You have lost your own debate. And furthermore you have posted against the BB rules.__________________
DHK
I was referring to the scripture 1John 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; You are the one who says you sin all the time. I didn't think you fit the scripture but if someone commits sin according to John is of the devil, not me.

1Jo 3:9Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

Are you of the Devil DHK:??1. As I expected you still cannot explain 1John 2:1.
2. To infer that I am of the devil is the lowest form of debate. It only shows that you have no answers. You have lost your own debate. And furthermore you have posted against the BB rules.
__________________
DHK
You cannot answer this one.

I can answer your scripture, it is talking about the flesh and not the inward man which is born of God, but commits a sin not unto death. As Jesus said, there is a sin not unto death.

1Jo 5:17All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death

Are you of the Devil DHK:??1. As I expected you still cannot explain 1John 2:1.
2. To infer that I am of the devil is the lowest form of debate. It only shows that you have no answers. You have lost your own debate. And furthermore you have posted against the BB rules.__________________
DHK
I apoligize for asking if you were of the devil. I just wanted you to know what scripture says about one who sins as you say the saved does, such as adultery.

1Jo 3:8He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

When you sin, as you continue to say that you do, it is not of God is it. Who is your sin of?



all scripture, as always. Not figures of speech, as you continue to use.
 
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Hope of Glory said:
Once again, this is not something we've said. But, I'm beginning to expect you to make things up.

We have not only stated that we are chastized in the flesh, but sometimes we pay the penalty in the flesh when someone else sins.

That does not preclude the chastizment the comes later for unconfessed sin.

Jesus' blood is sufficient to cover all sin.

But, you have to access it.

You do that by confessing your sin.

If you don't take advantage of it, doesn't mean the offer isn't there.

Tell you what? I'll give you $5. It's yours.

All you have to do is pick it up. I'm not shipping it to you.

Is it your $5?

Do you have it?
What are you talking about do you get chastise for what you do wrong in Gods sight because what it tells me that your a bastered and not a son that is if you do not get chastise. But you still have to confess that you sin and you still get chastised for that sin. Have you ever got chastise by your father? Did he chastise you for doing something wrong? Did you learn from that?That you should not do it again? I chastise my kids because I love them and I want them to know they done wrong. How can they learn that that was wrong if I do not show them. You don't get into trouble because someone else sin. You got into trouble because you sin. I don't thank God hates us because if he did he would let us go all the way to judgement unpunish and then condem us with out telling us that we did wrong before him. I am glad and thank him that he chastises for what other way shall I learn. I am glad I don't have to learn it in hell and that he loved me that he chastise me so I will learn not to do it again.
 

James_Newman

New Member
charles_creech78 said:
What are you talking about do you get chastise for what you do wrong in Gods sight because what it tells me that your a bastered and not a son that is if you do not get chastise. But you still have to confess that you sin and you still get chastised for that sin. Have you ever got chastise by your father? Did he chastise you for doing something wrong? Did you learn from that?That you should not do it again? I chastise my kids because I love them and I want them to know they done wrong. How can they learn that that was wrong if I do not show them. You don't get into trouble because someone else sin. You got into trouble because you sin. I don't thank God hates us because if he did he would let us go all the way to judgement unpunish and then condem us with out telling us that we did wrong before him. I am glad and thank him that he chastises for what other way shall I learn. I am glad I don't have to learn it in hell and that he loved me that he chastise me so I will learn not to do it again.

Brother, of course we get chastised in this life, and I do thank God for that. I wouldn't be married to my wife today if it weren't for God's loving chastisement. But there is no guarantee that when God lays the rod to our backs that we are going to respond the proper way. And when a child of God despises the chastising things are going to go bad for him.
 
James_Newman said:
Brother, of course we get chastised in this life, and I do thank God for that. I wouldn't be married to my wife today if it weren't for God's loving chastisement. But there is no guarantee that when God lays the rod to our backs that we are going to respond the proper way. And when a child of God despises the chastising things are going to go bad for him.
Yes I understand that more then anything. I know that there will be a punishment for eveything we do. I thank him that he is letting me know now before it is everlasting to late. Do you thank a man has told me that I have done wrong? NO GOD has told me that I have done wrong there is non good no not one they have all gone out of the way became filthy. I do not trust man I trust in God.
 

DHK

<b>Moderator</b>
Brother Bob said:
When you sin, as you continue to say that you do, it is not of God is it. Who is your sin of?
Bob when you continue to quote Scripture out of context, and not listen to what others tell you of the actual meaning of the verse you find yourself in deep trouble with other parts of the Bible which teach contrary to what you believe or your own theology. For example:

1 John 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

1 John 1:10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

Now according to the Scriptures, and your own method of literal interpretation: you have deceived yourself, the truth is not in you, you have made Christ a liar, and His word is not in you.

All of that just because you claim you cannot sin. You contradict the Scriptures.
 

Brother Bob

New Member
Now according to the Scriptures, and your own method of literal interpretation: you have deceived yourself, the truth is not in you, you have made Christ a liar, and His word is not in you.
And you accuse me of going against BB rules.

Bob when you continue to quote Scripture out of context, and not listen to what others tell you of the actual meaning of the verse you find yourself in deep trouble with other parts of the Bible which teach contrary to what you believe or your own theology. For example:

1 John 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

1 John 1:10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.
I guess, you will answer these scriptures for me then? You would not want to be hypocritical and do what you accuse me of?

1Jo 3:9Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

1Pe 4:1¶Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;

Hbr 10:26¶For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,


Originally Posted by Brother Bob
When you sin, as you continue to say that you do, it is not of God is it. Who is your sin of?
Also, you gave no answer for this one.
 
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TCGreek

New Member
James_Newman said:
Prove this from scripture. Exercise faith means to do something based on your faith. You exercise faith when you get on your knees and pray to God because you believe that He hears you. Noah exercised faith when he built the ark because he believed God was going to send a flood. Thats what James was talking about when he said faith without works is dead being alone. That is faith that is not exercised.

1. James, by "exercise faith" in the context of salvation means the same thing as "believe on/in" as in Acts 16:31.

2. You are the one who went to Noah; it wasn't me. I'm not addressing Noah.

3. The books of James is talking about something else. I'm talking about Eph 2:8 and "Through faith." "Through" is the Greek preposition dia and faith is pisteos, dia plus the genitive of pistis, here conveys instrumentality, "through faith."
 

James_Newman

New Member
TCGreek said:
1. James, by "exercise faith" in the context of salvation means the same thing as "believe on/in" as in Acts 16:31.
fine, you have your own dictionary and I'll have mine, but lets not allow things to get lost in the translation. If you say that believing is not enough, you are adding something to faith. When I said this
I'm going to go out on a limb and say all these brethren are saved. How do we get saved? It's by believing, not by giving diligence to do these things:

2 Peter 1:5-9
5 And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;
6 And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness;
7 And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity.
8 For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.
9 But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.

It says if you do these things, 'an entrance shall be ministered unto you' into the kingdom. But the man that doesn't has 'forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.' I don't know what being purged from sins means if it doesn't mean saved.

You said this:
We need to be able to balance God's sovereignty in salvation and our responsibility in both salvation and sanctification.

What do you believe is our responsibility in salvation, and does it involve anything listed in 2Pet 1:5-9?
 

DHK

<b>Moderator</b>
Brother Bob said:
I guess, you will answer these scriptures for me then?

1Jo 3:9Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

1Pe 4:1¶Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;

Hbr 10:26¶For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
Bob I am tired of playing games with you. You say you can give me an answer to 1John 2:1, but to do so you turn around and give me Catholic theology. Here is your so-called answer.
I can answer your scripture, it is talking about the flesh and not the inward man which is born of God, but commits a sin not unto death. As Jesus said, there is a sin not unto death.
Note that I had asked for an explanation of 1John 2:1. I will post the verse for you, so you can't miss it.

1 John 2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:

Bob, when you sin with the flesh you sin inwardly. You can't separate your flesh from your spirit. There are not two kinds of sins. I don't know how you objectively think this out. Can you extract your soul and spirit from your body, and sin with your flesh without using your brain (soul and spirit). Your differentiation is absolutely ludicrous. Everytime we use our flesh to sin, we use our souls and/or spirits to sin. The one cannot sin without the other. All sins are against God. That means that all sins are spiritual sins. In David's confession of his adultery and murder he said: "Against thee and thee alone have I sinned." So was it inward or of the flesh? All you have is a Roman Catholic differentiation of venial and mortal sin arbitrarily set by yourself. It isn't biblical.

So give a decent answer to 1John 2:1
"If any man sin" Why does John leave that door open?
Why does he expect believers to sin--implicit in that phrase "If any man sin"?
What is an advocate for?
Why does Christ have to be our advocate?

Explain this verse by answering these questions, and don't go off on other bunny trails. Do you think you do that this time Bob?
 

Amy.G

New Member
Amy:
1000 years of outerdarkness is nothing but punishment, which is not for the believer. It is for the unbeliever.
James Newman:
It is punishment. It is punishment designed to give you a godly fear and make you walk circumspectly instead of running to do mischief

Do you think you are going to run and do mischief in heaven?

The punishment takes place after you die, right? What mischief will we be doing in heaven after we've received our 1000 years of hell?
 
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