Could some of your children be not elect of God?

[utilyan]

It comes down loving God more than family in some extreme cases.

Is it God? or just the name tag?

 

[Particular]

That's a #3.

Sure, Paul is talking to the Ephesian who are (now) Christians. But he clearly says God had great love for us even while we were dead in trespasses and sins.

Plain as day, and undeniable.

God's great love for those he chose. Not for those who die in their sins.
It is plain as day. Why do you have it so muddy?
By the way, do you run a Chinese restaurant?

 

[kyredneck]

point taken and you are right....

...sooo easy to get sucked into it.

 

[rockytopva]

Christian parents produce Christian children

For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy. - 1 Corinthians 7:14

For this cause left I thee in Crete, that thou shouldest set in order the things that are wanting, and ordain elders in every city, as I had appointed thee: If any be blameless, the husband of one wife, having faithful children not accused of riot or unruly. - Titus 1:5-6

Do we not measure a man by his family? When we see a mans kids following him in the way it is a feather in his hat, especially when that man is in ministry. Unsaved children to me are a sign of trouble in the home.

 

[1689Dave]

Is it God? or just the name tag?

What fellowship does light have with darkness?

 

[Particular]

Do you have Paul's heart? Would YOU take their place? Do YOU have that passion for the lost?


Who says Calvinists do not want to see the lost saved? What Calvinist has EVER said otherwise?

I hope utilyan has edible sneakers.
A person who believes in the Supremacy of God also believes in following the commands of the King. That command is to go into all the world and make disciples, teaching and baptizing them in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit.
Churches who hold to the Supremacy of God are often the most missional as they understand their duty to share the gospel universally so that the elect from every tribe, tongue and nation might be able to receive the good news.
Utilyan simply won't accept this reality.

 

[utilyan]

This whole post is disgusting and an absolute attack on those that hold to Scriptural truth and characterizing us in ways that we have NEVER portrayed or expressed.

David I know you are a good person have a good heart and you want to do what is right.

Objection is great news. What part of my post is false exactly?

Plenty of folks would define Calvinism altogether as "absolute attack on those that hold to Scriptural truth and characterizing us in ways that we have NEVER portrayed or expressed"

 

[utilyan]

I hope utilyan has edible sneakers.
A person who believes in the Supremacy of God also believes in following the commands of the King. That command is to go into all the world and make disciples, teaching and baptizing them in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit.
Churches who hold to the Supremacy of God are often the most missional as they understand their duty to share the gospel universally so that the elect from every tribe, tongue and nation might be able to receive the good news.
Utilyan simply won't accept this reality.

God Commands ALL mankind to LOVE God and LOVE NEIGHBOR.

So which one of us is clueless as to God wanting all to be saved?

You'd think SUPREMACY OF God's Actual and WANT AND DESIRE would be evident there.

 

[utilyan]

What fellowship does light have with darkness?

If it quacks like the devil and wobbles like the devil, don't call it God.

 

[rockytopva]

Christian parents produce Christian children

For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy. - 1 Corinthians 7:14

For this cause left I thee in Crete, that thou shouldest set in order the things that are wanting, and ordain elders in every city, as I had appointed thee: If any be blameless, the husband of one wife, having faithful children not accused of riot or unruly. - Titus 1:5-6

Do we not measure a man by his family? When we see a mans kids following him in the way it is a feather in his hat, especially when that man is in ministry. Unsaved children to me are a sign of trouble in the home.

Throwing in the whole family along with the qualifications....
1 This is a true saying, if a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.
2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;
4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;
5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil. - 1 Timothy 3

 

[utilyan]

I hope utilyan has edible sneakers.
A person who believes in the Supremacy of God also believes in following the commands of the King. That command is to go into all the world and make disciples, teaching and baptizing them in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit.
Churches who hold to the Supremacy of God are often the most missional as they understand their duty to share the gospel universally so that the elect from every tribe, tongue and nation might be able to receive the good news.
Utilyan simply won't accept this reality.

If the edible sneakers were on the other foot. I wouldn't be upset by anything you say.

Since I've bought into the dumb idea that only God can change your heart and have you understand.

I would be wise enough to understand there is nothing I CAN DO to make you understand NOR ANYTHING ANOTHER or YOURSELF can DO to make yourself understand

It is ALL ON GOD. IT IS ALL ON GOD. DO you understand? IT IS ALL ON GOD. Only the holy spirit can change the heart and it is impossible for a person to understand the gospel or even WANT to understand. IT IS ALL ON GOD.

There is no way I would be caught debating or arguing with over any of these things with you.

Instead I would Pray ON YOUR BEHALF that God elect/save you.

I'm the BEST CALVINIST HERE.

All your threads should be YOU praying to God asking for the enlightenment and election of others.

Instead I clearly see none of you believe what you claim to believe.

 

[Christopher m]

Luke 9:46-48 comes to mind while reading this thread for some reason.

 

[Particular]

God Commands ALL mankind to LOVE God and LOVE NEIGHBOR.

So which one of us is clueless as to God wanting all to be saved?

You'd think SUPREMACY OF God's Actual and WANT AND DESIRE would be evident there.

You are making a false correlation between your first sentence and your second sentence.

Does all mankind love God? Does all mankind love their neighbor as themselves?

No they don't.

That comment has nothing to do with whom God wills to be saved.

If God willed all humans to be pardoned and saved, then all humans would, by virtue of God's choice, be pardoned and saved.

This means that you have created a false construct. Moreso, you refuse to acknowledge or change your false construct. To point: You are a stubborn person.

 

[Particular]

If it quacks like the devil and wobbles like the devil, don't call it God.

Great, we won't call you God. [emoji16]

 

[Particular]

If the edible sneakers were on the other foot. I wouldn't be upset by anything you say.

Since I've bought into the dumb idea that only God can change your heart and have you understand.

I would be wise enough to understand there is nothing I CAN DO to make you understand NOR ANYTHING ANOTHER or YOURSELF can DO to make yourself understand

It is ALL ON GOD. IT IS ALL ON GOD. DO you understand? IT IS ALL ON GOD. Only the holy spirit can change the heart and it is impossible for a person to understand the gospel or even WANT to understand. IT IS ALL ON GOD.

There is no way I would be caught debating or arguing with over any of these things with you.

Instead I would Pray ON YOUR BEHALF that God elect/save you.

I'm the BEST CALVINIST HERE.

All your threads should be YOU praying to God asking for the enlightenment and election of others.

Instead I clearly see none of you believe what you claim to believe.

You might consider yourself wise, but God would consider you disobedient. Therefore, we obey God...even if we cannot foresee his will.

 

[Scarlett O.]

Christian parents produce Christian children

Well, I gave lengthy post, but erased it.

Let's just let it be good enough for me to say that I 100% do not believe this is a guarantee at all. I do not believe this to be an algorithm for children being saved. I've see too much that says otherwise. Godly parent raising children in the fear of the Lord and the child rejecting it all and living a hell-bound life as an adult.

 

[utilyan]

You might consider yourself wise, but God would consider you disobedient. Therefore, we obey God...even if we cannot foresee his will.

If I believed what you believed. It would be absolutely impossible for me to be upset or frustrated with you or any opposition.

Under your teaching there is nothing I can do to have another person understand and believe.

Under your teaching there is nothing the other person can do to understand and believe.

Under your teaching God must personally intervene and grant the enlightenment and understanding

So why do you get frustrated with us? Why not just do your part of deliver the gospel and you are done.

You should be praying to God to change us.

 

[Van]

My God has graciously given me two lovely daughters, for whom I thank him.
The question is to my Calvinist brethren. Given your interpretation of Romans 9, where God elected/loved Jacob but rejected/hated Esau, do you countenance the very real possibility that some of your children may be predestinated to be rejected/hated of God and on their way to an eternal fire because of God's purpose of will to show off his wrath in them - and that there's nothing you can do about it? Or is it only other people's children that are damned?
I'm not talking about the possibility that some our children may not get saved because of their own freewill rejection - the way a non-Calvinist sees the matter.
I'm talking about the Calvinist idea that some of them may already be damned with no hope of salvation because of some eternal mysterious decree.

The doctrine of futility: You were saved or damned from all eternity for all eternity and there is nothing you can do to alter that outcome for your life or for the lives of your loved ones.

Romans 9 in no way supports the doctrine of futility, Jacob and Esau were not chosen for salvation under the new Covenant, so the Calvinist argument is a "prove A" and then claim "B" has been proven.

Ask yourself this, how could individuals who were called into His marvelous light have lived without mercy if they had been predestined to eternal life? 1 Peter 2:9-10

 

[Particular]

If I believed what you believed. It would be absolutely impossible for me to be upset or frustrated with you or any opposition.

Under your teaching there is nothing I can do to have another person understand and believe.

Under your teaching there is nothing the other person can do to understand and believe.

Under your teaching God must personally intervene and grant the enlightenment and understanding

So why do you get frustrated with us? Why not just do your part of deliver the gospel and you are done.

You should be praying to God to change us.

That's simply not true.
Everything I do is in obedience to God. He uses everything I do to accomplish His will. It is wonderfully joyful to obey my King and watch Him accomplish His will.

You assume I don't pray that God will open your heart to His Supremacy.

 

[Particular]

The doctrine of futility: You were saved or damned from all eternity for all eternity and there is nothing you can do to alter that outcome for your life or for the lives of your loved ones.

Romans 9 in no way supports the doctrine of futility, Jacob and Esau were not chosen for salvation under the new Covenant, so the Calvinist argument is a "prove A" and then claim "B" has been proven.

Ask yourself this, how could individuals who were called into His marvelous light have lived without mercy if they had been predestined to eternal life? 1 Peter 2:9-10

Grace has always been the means by which God saves. Dispensationalism is not a biblical means of discerning God's work. God has never changed his gracious choosing. He expresses it with Adam and Eve and continues this grace to eternity.