I just believe what I read IN THE BIBLE.
It’s unfortunate that it offends you, but I wIll continue to believe Scripture as written.
-
Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
I Now Know Why Some Deny the Rapture of the Church of Jesus Christ
- Thread starter JD731
- Start date
- Status
I just believe what I read IN THE BIBLE.
It’s unfortunate that it offends you, but I wIll continue to believe Scripture as written.
You are being disingenuous and nearly mirroring what Silverhair does.
Just because a person imterprets the Bible different than you, does not make their interpretation wrong and yours right.
We all believe what we see the text saying and as written.
For example: In Revelation 19 the text clearly says that all humanity will be devoured by the cultures, yet pre-trib/mill folks say it's only the kings and armies. Yet, the text says "all humanity" so who is believing what the text says?
No, you're only justified if you have faith.
and when He may come -- the Spirit of truth -- He will guide you to all the truth, for He will not speak from Himself, but as many things as He will hear He will speak, and the coming things He will tell you; John 16:13
And we -- we ought to give thanks to God always for you, brethren, beloved by the Lord, that God did choose you from the beginning to salvation, in [to] sanctification of the Spirit, <? of truth ?] and belief of the truth, 2 Thes 2:13
What is the truth of the Spirit, relative to, justification out of faith? ----- Whose, Faith?
having known also that a man is not declared righteous [justified] by works of law, if not through the faith of Jesus Christ, also we in Christ Jesus did believe [by the Spirit of Truth], that we might be declared righteous [ justified ] by [out] the [of] faith of Christ, and not by works of law, wherefore declared righteous by works of law shall be no flesh.' Gal 2:16
By the Spirit of Truth we into Christ Jesus believe that we have been justified out of faith of Christ.
Heb 5:7,8 who in the days of his flesh both prayers and supplications unto Him who was able to save him from [out of] death -- with strong crying and tears -- having offered up, and having been heard in respect to that which he feared, through being a Son, did learn by the things which he suffered -- the obedience,
The obedience of Faith.
Right or Wrong?
Any other understanding requires one to be responsible for his own justification and or salvation.
God chose you from the beginning and Son did learn the obedience of Faith unto death, even the death of the cross, Therefore God also has highly exalted Him [ A DEAD Man] and given Him the name which is above every name, Phil 2:9
Heb 5:9 and having been made perfect, [A DEAD Man] he did become to all those obeying him a cause of salvation age-during,
Again, Right or Wrong?
And we -- we ought to give thanks to God always for you, brethren, beloved by the Lord, that God did choose you from the beginning to salvation, in [to] sanctification of the Spirit, <? of truth ?] and belief of the truth, 2 Thes 2:13
What is the truth of the Spirit, relative to, justification out of faith? ----- Whose, Faith?
having known also that a man is not declared righteous [justified] by works of law, if not through the faith of Jesus Christ, also we in Christ Jesus did believe [by the Spirit of Truth], that we might be declared righteous [ justified ] by [out] the [of] faith of Christ, and not by works of law, wherefore declared righteous by works of law shall be no flesh.' Gal 2:16
By the Spirit of Truth we into Christ Jesus believe that we have been justified out of faith of Christ.
Heb 5:7,8 who in the days of his flesh both prayers and supplications unto Him who was able to save him from [out of] death -- with strong crying and tears -- having offered up, and having been heard in respect to that which he feared, through being a Son, did learn by the things which he suffered -- the obedience,
The obedience of Faith.
Right or Wrong?
Any other understanding requires one to be responsible for his own justification and or salvation.
God chose you from the beginning and Son did learn the obedience of Faith unto death, even the death of the cross, Therefore God also has highly exalted Him [ A DEAD Man] and given Him the name which is above every name, Phil 2:9
Heb 5:9 and having been made perfect, [A DEAD Man] he did become to all those obeying him a cause of salvation age-during,
Again, Right or Wrong?
CJP69
Active Member
"Offended" is too strong a word. I have a pretty thick skin.
CJP69
Active Member
How do you square that with Romans 4:1-6, part of which you quoted in your post?
Romans 4:1 What then shall we say that Abraham our father has found according to the flesh? 2 For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. 3 For what does the Scripture say? “Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.” 4 Now to him who works, the wages are not counted as grace but as debt.
5 But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness, 6 just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works:
5 But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness, 6 just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works:
Justified: by Christ’s blood, by grace, by faith, not by law.
Acts 13:39
And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses.
Romans 3:20
Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law [is] the knowledge of sin.
Romans 3:24
Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
Romans 3:28
Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.
Romans 4:2
For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath [whereof] to glory; but not before God.
Romans 5:1
Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:
Romans 5:9
Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.
Romans 8:30
Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
Galatians 2:16
Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
Galatians 3:11
But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, [it is] evident: for, The just shall live by faith.
Galatians 3:24
Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster [to bring us] unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
Galatians 5:4
Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.
Titus 3:7
That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
Acts 13:39
And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses.
Romans 3:20
Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law [is] the knowledge of sin.
Romans 3:24
Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
Romans 3:28
Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.
Romans 4:2
For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath [whereof] to glory; but not before God.
Romans 5:1
Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:
Romans 5:9
Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.
Romans 8:30
Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
Galatians 2:16
Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
Galatians 3:11
But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, [it is] evident: for, The just shall live by faith.
Galatians 3:24
Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster [to bring us] unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
Galatians 5:4
Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.
Titus 3:7
That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
timtofly
Well-Known Member
You are already justified. That is the point. You were justified before Genesis 1.
Of course if you accept God's work, that is your faith in action. But that faith does not do the justifying. Your faith only receives the justification already applied.
Of course if you never accept, that justification is pointless in your regard. It was never pointless from God's standpoint. You as a creation cannot dictate God's sovereignty.
So your faith has no power to justify your condition. Your faith allows you to receive the justication already accomplished by Jesus.
You are trying to define your faith as what did the work on the Cross.
timtofly
Well-Known Member
Neither I nor my faith died on the Cross for my own redemption.
That verse points out that even Abraham's work of obedience done in faith did not save him, only declared his righteousness in Christ. No human can manufacture their own righteousness.
The Law manufactured the righteousness of Israel as long as they did not break the Covenant with God. Keeping the Law did not manufacture righteousness, as it was only a type of what Jesus accomplished on the Cross. Paul kept pointing out that nothing we can do in this state of death, not even faith saves us. But the redemption of the Cross alone. Faith is not a work nor tangible. Faith is having nothing but trust in God. Can you make someone trust God. Can you give trust to another person for them? No, faith is not a commodity. The point of Hebrews 11 is they obeyed God when God gave them something specific to obey. Their obedience was their faith. Because they obeyed without knowing the outcome of their obedience. They were all still redeemed by the Cross, even though the Cross had not physically happened. Their obedience was credited to them as righteousness. They were justified by the Cross, not by their works, nor keeping the Law.
The book of James is viewing this new church arrangement from the perspective of the Law. Just having faith, as you all put it, is dead. There are no works done in faith to accompany that faith. And keeping the Law without faith or trust in God is just as pointless. But neither faith nor works can justify nor save anyone. Both are only applied after being obedient to God.
There is the example of the young rich man, who claimed to have never broken the law one time. Jesus pointed out he lacked one thing, faith. Jesus told him to sell everything he had and trust God, or show his faith, and that is where that man failed God. He could not give up his trust on money, to God. He had no faith. This lack of faith is what does not please God.
CJP69
Active Member
I've never understood this sort of theological hoop jumping. It never seems to solve the problem its intended to solve and usually ends up creating other issues that then have to have their own theological hoops created that in turn fail to solve the new problem and create even more. Why not just simply believe what the bible plainly states?
Ezekiel 18:19 [God's words] “Yet you say, ‘Why should the son not bear the guilt of the father?’ Because the son has done what is lawful and right, and has kept all My statutes and observed them, he shall surely live. 20 The soul who sins shall die. The son shall not bear the guilt of the father, nor the father bear the guilt of the son. The righteousness of the righteous shall be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon himself.
21 “But if a wicked man turns from all his sins which he has committed, keeps all My statutes, and does what is lawful and right, he shall surely live; he shall not die. 22 None of the transgressions which he has committed shall be remembered against him; because of the righteousness which he has done, he shall live. 23 Do I have any pleasure at all that the wicked should die?” says the Lord God, “and not that he should turn from his ways and live?
21 “But if a wicked man turns from all his sins which he has committed, keeps all My statutes, and does what is lawful and right, he shall surely live; he shall not die. 22 None of the transgressions which he has committed shall be remembered against him; because of the righteousness which he has done, he shall live. 23 Do I have any pleasure at all that the wicked should die?” says the Lord God, “and not that he should turn from his ways and live?
No, the Lord pointed out he didn’t keep all the commandments, because he was covetous.
Abraham believed God, and it was counted to him for righteousness. End of that fabrication.
37818
Well-Known Member
Truth.
Rightly Divided!... Brother Glen
2 Timothy 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
16 But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.
So you state that faith comes from truth.
Who or what is truth?
Rightly Divided!... Brother Glen
2 Timothy 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
16 But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.
If God in the person of Jesus Christ is not your Savior 100%... Are you your own?
The Lord Jesus is the Saviour of all men, specially of them that believe.
CJP69
Active Member
Psalm 33:4 For the word of the Lord is right, And all His work is done in truth.
Psalm 119:160 The entirety of Your word is truth, And every one of Your righteous judgments endures forever.
John 17:17 Sanctify them by Your truth. Your word is truth.
Romans 10:17 So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
37818
Well-Known Member
John 14:6, " . . . Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. . . ."
Romans 12:3, ". . . according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith. . . ."
- Status