Imprecatory Prayers - Your View?

[Harold Garvey]

I think it points to the emphasis of the SBC today which is not the same as it once was. If one goes back in time and takes a look at the kind of men who were in leadership then he would find men who were not only sound theologically but whom others recognized as godly men and supported them. If one takes a look at what the SBC did in terms of church planting, etc, in the past it was astounding.

It was not too long ago that the church took a stance against "investing" in the stock market. A few days ago I read some older documents which cited being involved in the stock market as a just reason for excommunicating someone. Now we have entire church organiozations involved in the stock market.

When I see churches involved in investing and making money it cause me to think about what lies ahead and it is seldom more ministry but a death or troubles ahead.

maybe the church had an unfounded principle in "excommunicating" people, I thought that was a practice of the RCC anyway?

Are you one of these gloom and doom preachers?

 

[Harold Garvey]

I would wonder how people see your point and how it fit in with the death penalty and in particular the lady who claimed to be a Christian and doing ministry who was executed in Texas a few years ago.

Well, how much more random can we be? I don't have any idea of what you're talking about and won't waste the time researching something so radically random.

 

[Harold Garvey]

My larger belief is that while abortion is horrendous, it does not represent the whole teaching about how we are to respect human life. The larger picture is called the Sanctity of Life. This perspective instructs us that ALL human life is precious to God. In my view, this includes those who lose their lives in war both combatants and innocents and those who are executed by the state (capital punishment).

In my experience most professing Christians disagree with this perspective and claim that the Bible supports both war and capital punishment. The only major religious group that supported the Iraq war was the SBC. All others came out against it as unjust and an unnecessary taking of human life.

Um, you could not be more wrong. I know of NO IFB that IS against the war in Iraq, nor were they ever against it.

Jesus said:

Mat 5:38 Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:
Mat 5:39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.

Mat 5:43 Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.
Mat 5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

Yep, I'd pray they get saved before we march in and have to punish them until they submit to the authority we have in protecting ourselves and establishing the same freedom for generations to come or they will DIE.

I think you're misappliying the passage. There is a deadline to trying to win your enemies over, besides, when it comes to turning the other cheek, well, I've only got two, so how many more cheeks should I turn and how many times did we turn the other cheek concerning Sadam?

What I see here is either two things; the first you don't understand the passage, the other is you don't know how much the USA put up with out of Sadam before we acted.

We may have acted speedily in response to 9/11, but it is warranted and should have happened MUCH sooner, like 1996 or something.

 

[Harold Garvey]

An interesting thread. A Christian should never pray for harm to come to a fellow human being.

Um, what about when Jesus told judas to "go do quickly"? I know this wasn't a "prayer", but it was certainly an action of God which ultimately ended with the death of judas and the Cross of Calvary. I think maybe you for got things like this. Besides, that line of thinking is evidence of humanism and its effects upon Christianity.

 

[annsni]

Um, what about when Jesus told judas to "go do quickly"? I know this wasn't a "prayer", but it was certainly an action of God which ultimately ended with the death of judas and the Cross of Calvary. I think maybe you for got things like this. Besides, that line of thinking is evidence of humanism and its effects upon Christianity.

You mean to say that Christ telling Judas do go ahead and do what He knew Judas was going to do - and what God had ordained to happen - is a good comparison with praying that someone will die?

We're talking two TOTALLY different things!

 

[Freedom]

You had to be there. Wiley Drake is known as a maverick in SBC circles. He comes to the convention armed with a bunch of resolutions to offer, few of which ever make it to a vote.

He was nominated by a Western Kentucky pastor named Bill Dotson, whom I know. Dr. Dotson also marches to his own drummer. But I tell you, the nominating speech was slap-dab funny. It had the messengers holding their sides. It sort of pictured Bro. Drake as quirky but harmless, and that was it. He was elected.

So his election says nothing about the current SBC leadership, and it really says nothing about the convention itself.

So you're telling me that this man was elected as Second Vice President of the SBC because the man who nominated him told a few good jokes? That in itself tells me a LOT about the convention.

 

[gb93433]

Well, how much more random can we be? I don't have any idea of what you're talking about and won't waste the time researching something so radically random.

Remember your post earlier? My prayer would have been that this man be given an opportunity to repent of his great sins and accept Jesus Christ as his Lord and Savior before he died. That opportunity was taken away by his murderer.

Many "religious" folks are in favor of the death penalty and I am sure you know what states they live in.I costs more for a death penalty case than to put a person in prison for life.I agree with what you stated.

 

[gb93433]

maybe the church had an unfounded principle in "excommunicating" people, I thought that was a practice of the RCC anyway?

Are you one of these gloom and doom preachers?

My point was to show how yesterday's orthodoxy and taboos have become today's orthodoxy and practice.

 

[gb93433]

Are you one of these gloom and doom preachers?

I see very little difference in the stock market over which I have no control than gambling for which I have no control. Working for our money is far more sure and seldom loses.

 

[gb93433]

Are you one of these gloom and doom preachers?

The Bible does talk about how fickle money can be.

 

[canadyjd]

Originally Posted by KenH An interesting thread. A Christian should never pray for harm to come to a fellow human being.

Read the Psalms to see different..... chapter 55 comes to mind.

Read I Tim. 2:1-3 to see different.


(v.1)"First of all, then, I urge that entreaties, prayers, petitions, and thanksgivings be made on behalf of all men,....(v.3)This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior...."

What is "good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior" is to pray on behalf of all men, not against men....not that men would die.

peace to youraying:

 

[Freedom]

Um, you could not be more wrong. I know of NO IFB that IS against the war in Iraq, nor were they ever against it.

Yep, I'd pray they get saved before we march in and have to punish them until they submit to the authority we have in protecting ourselves and establishing the same freedom for generations to come or they will DIE.

I think you're misappliying the passage. There is a deadline to trying to win your enemies over, besides, when it comes to turning the other cheek, well, I've only got two, so how many more cheeks should I turn and how many times did we turn the other cheek concerning Sadam?

What I see here is either two things; the first you don't understand the passage, the other is you don't know how much the USA put up with out of Sadam before we acted.

We may have acted speedily in response to 9/11, but it is warranted and should have happened MUCH sooner, like 1996 or something.

I think you're misappliying the passage. There is a deadline to trying to win your enemies over, besides, when it comes to turning the other cheek, well, I've only got two, so how many more cheeks should I turn and how many times did we turn the other cheek concerning Sadam?

------------------------------------------------------------------------

This is both the letter and the spirit of Christ's teaching on this.

Mat 18:21 Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times?
Mat 18:22 Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven.

 

[EdSutton]

I think you're misappliying the passage. There is a deadline to trying to win your enemies over, besides, when it comes to turning the other cheek, well, I've only got two, so how many more cheeks should I turn and how many times did we turn the other cheek concerning Sadam?

Please don't derail the thread with a political issue, regardless of where you happen to stand on it.

Thanks, and FTR, the name of Wiley Drake was either placed in nomination for President of the SBC, last year at Indianapolis, or they planned to but did not, as because someone was ill, they and decided to withdraw it, with the someone not being present, and I don't actually remember which it was.

I did have either the fortune or misfortune to be approached by supporters of each and every candidate for that office, at the Convention.

One person's name was not placed in nomination for that reason, if my memory is actually correct on this. Perhaps someone else who was there with a better memory than mine can tell us who that person is.

Thanks,

Ed

 

[EdSutton]

The title of the thread: "Imprecatory Prayers--Your View?

...

Keep the thread on topic.

Nice try, but it appears that it hasn't worked.

Ed

 

[Freedom]

Please don't derail the thread with a political issue, regardless of where you happen to stand on it.

Thanks, and FTR, the name of Wiley Drake was either placed in nomination for President of the SBC, last year at Indianapolis, or they planned to but did not, as because someone was ill, they and decided to withdraw it, with the someone not being present, and I don't actually remember which it was.

I did have either the fortune or misfortune to be approached by supporters of each and every candidate for that office, at the Convention.

One person's name was not placed in nomination for that reason, if my memory is actually correct on this. Perhaps someone else who was there with a better memory than mine can tell us who that person is.

Thanks,

Ed

Originally Posted by Harold Garvey
Um, you could not be more wrong. I know of NO IFB that IS against the war in Iraq, nor were they ever against it.

Yep, I'd pray they get saved before we march in and have to punish them until they submit to the authority we have in protecting ourselves and establishing the same freedom for generations to come or they will DIE.

I think you're misappliying the passage. There is a deadline to trying to win your enemies over, besides, when it comes to turning the other cheek, well, I've only got two, so how many more cheeks should I turn and how many times did we turn the other cheek concerning Sadam?

What I see here is either two things; the first you don't understand the passage, the other is you don't know how much the USA put up with out of Sadam before we acted.

We may have acted speedily in response to 9/11, but it is warranted and should have happened MUCH sooner, like 1996 or something.

 

[Bro. Curtis]

Originally Posted by Harold Garvey
Um, you could not be more wrong. I know of NO IFB that IS against the war in Iraq, nor were they ever against it.

I am IFB, and am against both wars we have going right now, and am against the wars Obama is preparing for in Pakistan, Darfur, & Somalia.

 

[thegospelgeek]

Wouldn't it make more sense to pray for his salvation? I mean really, what Christian would prefer an unsaved man die rather tahn be saved? Could you imagine if Obama woke one day, called a press conference, and annouced that he was born again that night and started REAL change in DC?

 

[Freedom]

Please don't derail the thread with a political issue, regardless of where you happen to stand on it.

Thanks, and FTR, the name of Wiley Drake was either placed in nomination for President of the SBC, last year at Indianapolis, or they planned to but did not, as because someone was ill, they and decided to withdraw it, with the someone not being present, and I don't actually remember which it was.

I did have either the fortune or misfortune to be approached by supporters of each and every candidate for that office, at the Convention.

One person's name was not placed in nomination for that reason, if my memory is actually correct on this. Perhaps someone else who was there with a better memory than mine can tell us who that person is.

Thanks,

Ed

Did you catch my response, Ed. I didn't introduce politics into the thread. Please read closely the post.

 

[Freedom]

I am IFB, and am against both wars we have going right now, and am against the wars Obama is preparing for in Pakistan, Darfur, & Somalia.

So you expressed your opposition during Bush's reign, right?

 

[Bro. Curtis]

Yup. You know this, as we discussed it when you posted here under the "Just Christian" moniker.

How dare you.