• Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Is The Papacy Threatened?

Status
Not open for further replies.

DHK

<b>Moderator</b>
I was saved at my Baptism by the grace of God (power of Christ). The Holy Spirit came and now dwells within me.

As a Baptist I was taught that a person could take scripture and interpret it for oneself as guided by the Holy Spirit. Has this changed? Did I miss the memo?
You are a deceiver.

You say you belong to the First Baptist Church in Dotham, Alabama.

Here is what they say:
THE MOST IMPORTANT QUESTION

“Sirs, what must I do to be saved?” This question came from the lips of a jailer in the city of Philippi. A great earthquake opened the doors of the prison cells, including the cell that housed Paul and Silas, followers of Jesus Christ who were imprisoned because of their faith in Him. The jailer, supposing that all of the prisoners had escaped and that he would certainly be punished unto death by the Roman authorities, was going to kill himself with his own sword. However, when he discovered that Paul and Silas, who earlier had been singing praises unto God, and all of the other prisoners, instead of fleeing, had remained in the prison, he recognized that there was something in their lives that he needed. Thus he cried out, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?” (Acts 16:30) Their answer was life changing, “Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household” (Acts 16:31)
In a very complicated, "religious" world... God has made salvation simple. "Whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved." (Romans 10:13). Your salvation experience will be the beginning of your relationship with Jesus Christ. Understanding salvation is as simple as "A.B.C."
Admit that you're a sinner in need of God
Believe that Jesus died and rose again for your sins.
Confess Jesus as Lord of your life!


But what does it mean to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ? and what exactly does mean to be saved?



  1. [*] To believe on the Lord Jesus Christ means to agree with God’s word that you are a sinner. – “for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God” (Romans 3:23).


    [*] To believe on the Lord Jesus Christ means to agree with God’s word that you are a sinner who deserves the punishment for sin – “For the wages of sin is death” (Roman 6:23a). “But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death” (Revelation 21:8)


    [*] To believe on the Lord Jesus Christ means to agree with God’s word that you are a sinner who deserves the punishment for sin, that you cannot save yourself, and that your only hope is a Savior – “but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord” (Romans 6:23b).


    [*] To believe on the Lord Jesus Christ means to agree with God’s word that you are a sinner who deserves the punishment for sin, that you cannot save yourself, that your only hope is a Savior, and that Jesus Christ is the only Savior – “And this is the testimony: that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son. He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life” (I John 5:11-12).


    [*] To believe on the Lord Jesus Christ means to agree with God’s word that you are a sinner who deserves the punishment for sin, that you cannot save yourself, that you need a Savior, that Jesus Christ is the only Savior, that you are trusting in Him and Him alone for forgiveness of sin and that you are surrendering to Him as the Lord of your life – “If you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation” (Romans 10:9-10).

Will you repent (turn away from sin) and place your trust in Jesus Christ as God in the flesh who died in your place as the sacrifice for your sin? Here's a simple prayer you can pray... make it your own.

God, I know that I am a sinner and that I cannot save myself. I turn from my sin and trust Jesus Christ, Your Son, as my Savior. Dear Lord Jesus, come into my heart, cleanse me of sin, and make me the person that you want me to be. I surrender my life to You, the Lord of heaven and earth. Thank you for saving me. In the name of Jesus Christ I pray. Amen.”

Please let us know of your commitment to Jesus Christ. It's important you understand the decision you just made, and we want to rejoice with you and give you some information that will help you grow in your new life in Christ. No one is an island. You were not made to walk this walk alone. The body of Christ is here to help you on your new adventure! Please let me know!

http://www.fbcdothan.org/question.htm

Your claim to being a Baptist is false. The First Baptist Church at Dotham, Alabama does not believe what you believe. There is not one word of being baptism in their message of salvation, not even one.
What you believe is either Catholic or Church of Christ. Which one? Why not be truthful?


 

BillySunday1935

New Member
Well, let’s look at Luke 3:7-9 in context…

7John said to the crowds coming out to be baptized by him, "You brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the coming wrath?

8Produce fruit in keeping with repentance. And do not begin to say to yourselves, 'We have Abraham as our father.' For I tell you that out of these stones God can raise up children for Abraham.

9The axe is already at the root of the trees, and every tree that does not produce good fruit will be cut down and thrown into the fire."

John is speaking of works here and that those who do not “produce good fruit” [good works] will be thrown into hell. It just doesn’t say what you are attempting to make it say.

Yes the works that result in repentance. Not baptism. It says exactly what I suggested that it does.


Really? Hmmm… So some works result in repentance and repentance results in our going to heaven (salvation)? That sure sounds like work based salvation to me.

Repentance is required - as is baptism. There is nothing contrary to the salvific nature of baptism in that passage. Ironically, the verse is crystal clear: “Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ FOR THE REMISSION OF SINS.” And what do we then receive? The GIFT of the Holy Spirit.

Indeed repentance is required baptism is a result of repentance not the other way round. Salvation come in the form of "repent" and be baptized part of it is the resulting action not affecting salvation. Consider the theif on the cross. There is no baptism for him however none claim that he wasn't saved.

OK - let us consider the thief on the cross. First, how do we know he wasn’t already baptized? It is not out of the realm of possibility. Secondly, if I remember correctly he came to the defense of our Lord on the cross. That act, like Baptism, is an action – a work!

Yes - however, God uses Baptism to confer that grace, as is clearly indicated in the very scripture that you are addressing. Here it is again: “Arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord” This is consistent throughout scripture.


The term Confering Grace sounds sacramental rather than ordinational. Sacraments confer grace by participating in the act of the sacrament. Baptism is a resulting obedience to a grace that has already been confered on the believer. Baptism just shows what has already occured. Its a witness.

Where is any of that in scripture? What I have shown is that baptism is salvific and is consistently portrayed thusly throughout scripture.

The scripture here does not say that - it is referring to being baptized into the body of Christ by the Holy Spirit through Baptism.

Scripture says exactly that. Its refering to being already in a state of Grace through the spirit where then we are baptised into the same unified body of Christ. Baptism is the witness in this case.

Please show me where scripture states that Baptism is the witness to anything.

13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body

then you say

Sure – just look at the next verse.
"12 Buried with him in baptism..."

verse 12 begins an advancing in flow of thought not a definition of modern exchange of circumsision.

Lets look at in context.

1 Corinthians 12:10-15
10 to another miraculous powers, to another prophecy, to another distinguishing between spirits, to another speaking in different kinds of tongues, and to still another the interpretation of tongues.

11 All these are the work of one and the same Spirit [the gifts of the Holy Spirit], and he gives them to each one, just as he determines.

12 The body is a unit, though it is made up of many parts; and though all its parts are many, they form one body. So it is with Christ.

There’s the old analogy again…
A body has many parts – just as your body has many parts so the body of Christ has many parts [members].


13For we were all baptized byone Spirit [the Holy Spirit] into one body[the Body of Christ] —whether Jews or Greeks, slave or free—and we were all given the one Spirit to drink.

OK – in verse 11 the Holy Spirit gives us different gifts. Now in verse 13 that same Holy Spirit baptizes us. But that’s only one half of the equation.

John 3:5
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

Again it’s both water [baptism] and the Spirit [the Holy Spirit]. If it’s not, then these scriptures contradict each other. Cleary they don’t if taken all together.

Again I point you back to Jesus’ own baptism. Did he need to repent? No! And what happened directly after he arose from the water? The spirit descended upon him from above.

And what did Jesus say to John the baptist? He wanted to fulfill all righteousness. His baptism lead the way of obedience to the Will of God.

And his baptism set the example for us right there - Water and the Spirit.

And ask yourself this. If Baptism is necissary for salvation why didn't Jesus baptize?

The exception proves the rule? Hardly!
I don’t know why didn't Jesus baptize and niether do you. However, perhaps we’ll find out someday.


And why did Paul say his mission was not to baptize?

As pointed out in 1 Corinthians 12:10 above, we all have been given different gifts and different missions. God determines who gets what.

Because what is important is the baptism in the Holy Spirit (not pentecostal thinking here) or being born from above.

Woah there … Not according to scripture. What is important is what is stated in scripture - being born of water AND the Spirit.

Again I point you Jesus’ last command to the Apostles.


In Matthew 28:19
19Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost

Hmm… It sure sounds pretty important to me. :)

Peace!
 

Amy.G

New Member
OK - let us consider the thief on the cross. First, how do we know he wasn’t already baptized? It is not out of the realm of possibility. Secondly, if I remember correctly he came to the defense of our Lord on the cross. That act, like Baptism, is an action – a work!
That is the same argument our resident Catholic has tried to make.

I think you are a Catholic. A deceitful one at that.
 

BillySunday1935

New Member
You are a deceiver.

Oh Lordy -- here we go with the name calling.

You say you belong to the First Baptist Church in Dotham, Alabama.

Here is what they say:

snip...

Your claim to being a Baptist is false. The First Baptist Church at Dotha[n], Alabama does not believe what you believe. There is not one word of being bapti[zed] in their message of salvation, not even one.
What you believe is either Catholic or Church of Christ. Which one? Why not be truthful?

You know, it might help to read my responses before dashing off to the FBCOD website and flailing away at the keyboard in hot pursuit of conspiracy.

The last time I checked, we have the right to interpret scripture as led by the Holy Spirit. Believe whatever you want.
:cool:
 

DHK

<b>Moderator</b>

The last time I checked, we have the right to interpret scripture as led by the Holy Spirit. Believe whatever you want.
:cool:
No you don't have that right. No Baptist Church of any stripe would admit a Mormon (for example) into their membership, neither a Hindu, or Muslim, etc. Neither would they admit someone who believes in baptismal regeneration (a Hindu belief). This is heresy and not in accord with their statement of faith. A church does not admit someone who is not in accordance with their statement of faith.

This "I can believe whatever I want" philosophy is Satanic.
It is clearly not of God and totally against the Scripture.
Do you also believe that Christ is an angel--just whatever you want??
 

BillySunday1935

New Member
It flew out the window when Jude said: "to contend for the faith," and one comes on the board as a deceiver spouting devilish heresy.

So having a different opinion than you makes me "...a deceiver spouting devilish heresy"?

1 Peter 3:15 (New International Version)
15 But in your hearts set apart Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect.
 

Alive in Christ

New Member
"What an ugly thing to say. Whatever happened to Christian charity?"

As a Baptist myself. I have to say I am disappointed in the venomous responses that are sadly being thrown around, and directed at Sunday1935.

Nothing wrong with disagreeing, but there is a point it crosses the line. I believe the line has been crossed on this thread.

BillySunday1935...

I disagree with what you are posting, but I want to apologise for the thoughtless and vitriolic attacks by my Baptist brothers and sisters on this thread.
 

DHK

<b>Moderator</b>
So having a different opinion than you makes me "...a deceiver spouting devilish heresy"?

1 Peter 3:15 (New International Version)
15 But in your hearts set apart Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect.
2 Peter 2:1-2 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.
2 And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of.

The baptismal regeneration that you speak of is not a Baptist doctrine, never was a Baptist doctrine, and is, as is described here, a damnable heresy.
It is not simply a "difference of opinion."
 

BillySunday1935

New Member
No you don't have that right.

I was trying to provoke a response from you on this. Looks like it worked. ;)

No Baptist Church of any stripe would admit a Mormon (for example) into their membership, neither a Hindu, or Muslim, etc. Neither would they admit someone who believes in baptismal regeneration (a Hindu belief).

No Baptist Church would - none - not one in the entire world? That's a broad statement there, DHK.

This is heresy and not in accord with their statement of faith. A church does not admit someone who is not in accordance with their statement of faith.

There are tons of non-denominational churchs out there that seriously don't care and don't even ask. So - when we have differences in interpretation, what are we to do?

This "I can believe whatever I want" philosophy is Satanic. It is clearly not of God and totally against the Scripture.

Well I most certainly agree with you there. However, it is rampant.

Do you also believe that Christ is an angel--just whatever you want??

Nope - never said so.

Peace!
 
Last edited by a moderator:

DHK

<b>Moderator</b>
No Baptist Church would - none - not one in the entire world? That's a broad statement there, DHK.
If a Baptist church invited into membership other religions such as Islam and Hindus, then it would no longer be Baptist, would it? So my statement still stands.
There a tons of non-denominational churchs out there that seriously don't care and don't even ask. So - when we have differences in interpretation, what are we to do?
A non-denominational church is not a Baptist church, which is what I was talking about. Baptist churches do care about doctrine.
 

Amy.G

New Member
As a Baptist myself. I have to say I am disappointed in the venomous responses that are sadly being thrown around, and directed at Sunday1935.

Nothing wrong with disagreeing, but there is a point it crosses the line. I believe the line has been crossed on this thread.

BillySunday1935...

I disagree with what you are posting, but I want to apologise for the thoughtless and vitriolic attacks by my Baptist brothers and sisters on this thread.

It is not venomous to call a spade a spade.

It is not venomous to contend for the faith.

DHK is correct that what this fellow believes is not Baptist doctrine. He comes on the BB and goes straight to the Catholic thread, promotes works salvation and then claims to be a Baptist. Something is rotten here.

I like you Alive in Christ, but please do not apologize for me. I will do that myself when proven wrong.
 

BillySunday1935

New Member
2 Peter 2:1-2 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.
2 And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of.

The baptismal regeneration that you speak of is not a Baptist doctrine, never was a Baptist doctrine, and is, as is described here, a damnable heresy.
It is not simply a "difference of opinion.
"

OK - since baptismal regeneration is not a Baptist doctrine, then according to Peter it is a damnable heresy. Interesting...

I didn't know that Peter was a Baptist. Hurrah!

Peace!
 

BillySunday1935

New Member
If a Baptist church invited into membership other religions such as Islam and Hindus, then it would no longer be Baptist, would it? So my statement still stands.

A non-denominational church is not a Baptist church, which is what I was talking about. Baptist churches do care about doctrine
.

I'm sorry - you wrote "A Church..." My mistake.
 

DHK

<b>Moderator</b>
OK - since baptismal regeneration is not a Baptist doctrine, then according to Peter it is a damnable heresy. Interesting...

I didn't know that Peter was a Baptist. Hurrah!

Peace!
Well, yes and no.
Baptists are Bible-believers. We believe the Bible as our final authority in all things in faith and practice. Our beliefs are the Bible. What the Bible teaches, that we believe. Thus in essence, Peter was a Baptist, for Baptists would believe the same as Peter.
 

BillySunday1935

New Member
It is not venomous to call a spade a spade.

It is not venomous to contend for the faith.

DHK is correct that what this fellow believes is not Baptist doctrine. He comes on the BB and goes straight to the Catholic thread
snip...

My goodness -- I thought members could go anywhere on this board as long as they observe the forum rules. :confused:

snip ...promotes works salvation and then claims to be a Baptist.

I'm am only stating my opinions and my interpretation of scripture. Calling that "promoting" implies that I am attempting make this belief more attrative to others. That is simply not the case. I am engaging in what I thought would be intellectual discourse.

Peace!
 

DHK

<b>Moderator</b>
My goodness -- I thought members could go anywhere on this board as long as they observe the forum rules. :confused:
There is a section for Baptists and a section for non-Baptists.
It would be good for you to stay down here in the non-Baptist section until you can verify to us that you are a Baptist.
I'm am only stating my opinions and my interpretation of scripture. Calling that "promoting" implies that I am attempting make this belief more attrative to others. That is simply not the case. I am engaging in what I thought would be intellectual discourse.
Opinions are not the same as dogma or doctrine.
One can have an opinion about who the two witnesses will be in Revelation chapter eleven. That has not been clearly revealed for us.
There is no opinion allowed concerning who Christ is--the second person of the triune Godhead, deity, fully God and fully man.
There is no opinion about salvation: faith alone in Christ alone. If you have a different belief, a different doctrine than that then your doctrine is not Baptist. You would not be allowed to post in Baptist forums.

Please explain why your doctrine differs from Baptist doctrine, even the doctrine of the church that you claim to be a member. This is not just a matter of opinion. This is essential doctrine concerning the salvation of a soul, thus very vital doctrine.
 

BillySunday1935

New Member
As a Baptist myself. I have to say I am disappointed in the venomous responses that are sadly being thrown around, and directed at Sunday1935.

Nothing wrong with disagreeing, but there is a point it crosses the line. I believe the line has been crossed on this thread.

BillySunday1935...

I disagree with what you are posting, but I want to apologise for the thoughtless and vitriolic attacks by my Baptist brothers and sisters on this thread.

Well, that is mighty nice of you sir. However, at my age I should be able to handle it.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top