Lordship salvation vs Easy believeism

[HankD]

On the day Christ saved me these two things (among many others) happened:

1) Believing on Him became one of the easiest things I know how to do.
2) He made Himself Lord of my life.

HankD

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Anybody ever tell ya that because you do such and such, then you really cant be a genuine true to life Christian?

 

[JamesL]

Anybody ever tell ya that because you do such and such, then you really cant be a genuine true to life Christian?

Yup. I've heard that nonsense from those who promote the heresy of Lordship Salvation.

And they've each got a list of "offenses" that puts somebody outside of grace.

And I'll bet you dollars to donuts that nothing they do is on their list.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Yup. I've heard that nonsense from those who promote the heresy of Lordship Salvation.

And they've each got a list of "offenses" that puts somebody outside of grace.

And I'll bet you dollars to donuts that nothing they do is on their list.

Oh they still surprise themselves....like a good looking woman congeres up thoughts (that must be suppressed) or a swear word passes the lips of those holier than thou, or whatever....but they cant let that be seen.....Heaven forbid. Its just hypocracy. And we are all hypocrates....but its vital that it never be exposed amongst the Holy ....its forbidden!

 

[quantumfaith]

Oh they still surprise themselves....like a good looking woman congeres up thoughts (that must be suppressed) or a swear word passes the lips of those holier than thou, or whatever....but they cant let that be seen.....Heaven forbid. Its just hypocracy. And we are all hypocrates....but its vital that it never be exposed amongst the Holy ....its forbidden!

:thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:

 

[evangelist6589]

I will be charitable and say that you are misinformed. There are those who believe in Lordship Salvation who reject Reformed Theology (not Reformation Theology). So, that misunderstanding is now debunked.



As far as your charge that Lordship Salvation is an akin to Rome's justification by works, well, I will dispense with being charitable and say that your are spewing utter rubbish. I typically avoid responding to your posts, but this travesty of an accusation deserves to be rebuked in the strongest possible terms.



What problem do you have with professed Christians being expected to act like Christians? Justification has always been, and always will be, by faith. No one is justified by works. But a genuine salvation will always result in a changed life. Always and without fail. If any man be in Christ, he is a new creature. Old things have passed away. Behold! All things have become new (2 Cor. 5:17). Go back to my first post in this thread for the biblical reasons why Lordship Salvation is what the Bible teaches. I will rightly charge you with Antinomianism (which is what the "free grace" movement is).

This is quite correct. I know non Calvinists that affirm Lordship Salvation.

 

[evangelist6589]

The distinction would be in the use of the word Inevitable



If works are the "inevitable" fruit of saving faith, then works are required in order to validate faith. Or, it could rightly be said that without works there is no hope of heaven.



Remember that Lordship Salvation is nothing but Reformation Theology in full swing, which itself is nothing but an adaptation of Rome's justification by works.

This is false James. What say you of James MacDonald (a non Calvinist) whom fully holds to Lordship salvation? Read his tract on repentance, read his books, or hear his sermons. The man is no Calvinist but fully understands Lordship Salvation.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

This is quite correct. I know non Calvinists that affirm Lordship Salvation.

And I know Calvinists that don't. So what....see you view Lordship Salvation to be the only position to hold and anything else is not valid. Thats an arrogant stance to take brother and you seem to be falling into that trap. Now I don't consider LS to be heredical or anything harsh like that but it does tend to draw a judgemental line in the sand.....and I believe that our God is one of both Judgement and Mercy....or else there would be NO Grace.

 

[Thousand Hills]

So do you believe in Lordship salvation or Easy believeism or both? Please explain why or why not.

LS.

Let's look at the great commission, these little tid bits (in bold) are often left out.

18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

I like this snippet from Brother PW. Christ is Lord of all. At the end of the clip he tells it like it is, if God began a good work in you he will finish it. If there is no change in your life than nothing has happened.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a11ASw5NRUw

 

[Jedi Knight]

Can someone say "I accept you as savior but cannot be Lord over me"?

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Can someone say "I accept you as savior but cannot be Lord over me"?

Not even the Roman Catholic....but in their doctrine, when they sin they have the sacrument of confession to right them again.

 

[JamesL]

Can someone say "I accept you as savior but cannot be Lord over me"?

People can say anything they want to. Saying something doesn't make it biblical

Trying to "accept" Him as Savior OR Lord may well leave someone lost. He accepts us, not the other way around.

Oh, I forgot. I think the good Jedi Master has me on ignore. Would someone be so kind as to quote this post?

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

LS.

Let's look at the great commission, these little tid bits (in bold) are often left out.

18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

OK...who did our lord specifically speak to?

I like this snippet from Brother PW. Christ is Lord of all. At the end of the clip he tells it like it is, if God began a good work in you he will finish it. If there is no change in your life than nothing has happened.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a11ASw5NRUw

Nobody is disagreeing with that brother...it is the work of the HS that through grace that changes the person. But are we to be thexones who cast judgemental apon our brothers because we don't see the works happening. Did not the Pharisees continuiously do that....ie set up stumbling blocks that only they could judge people....so that when they do stumble and fall...!

No, our Lord is conserned mainly to give a true account of the law. HE does this by teaching us not to judge,not to commit adultery, not to kill....etc. In effect He is saying that "I am the Lord and my interpertations are the true legal ones...the true ones"....but I trust we are all in agreement with that.

 

[evangelist6589]

And I know Calvinists that don't. So what....see you view Lordship Salvation to be the only position to hold and anything else is not valid. Thats an arrogant stance to take brother and you seem to be falling into that trap. Now I don't consider LS to be heredical or anything harsh like that but it does tend to draw a judgemental line in the sand.....and I believe that our God is one of both Judgement and Mercy....or else there would be NO Grace.

This is false. I recognize non LS types as christians.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

This is false. I recognize non LS types as christians.

Good!....then why is it the job of others to validate faith? Is mankind not human and prone to making mistakes? Who is the only one fit to make that judgemental call?

 

[Reformed]

Good!....then why is it the job of others to validate faith? Is mankind not human and prone to making mistakes? Who is the only one fit to make that judgemental call?

I will speak from a pastoral perspective. I have an obligation to shepherd those under my charge. If someone make a profession of faith and never displays fruit, I should be concerned. Since we are all our brothers keeper, all of us have the same responsibility one to another. It is not a matter of judgment. It is a matter of adelphos, brotherly love.

Look at your own situation for a second. You are not a member of a local church. Ergo you are not under pastoral oversight. It is a hard thing to live as a Christian without accountability. And I am not pointing the finger at you. I need the same accountability. I need others to be concerned for my soul and to correct me (in love) if I stray.

 

[Greektim]

So do you believe in Lordship salvation or Easy believeism or both? Please explain why or why not.

I think only evangelist6589 is aloud to start threads on LS. It is in the BB by-laws I believe.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

I will speak from a pastoral perspective. I have an obligation to shepherd those under my charge. If someone make a profession of faith and never displays fruit, I should be concerned. Since we are all our brothers keeper, all of us have the same responsibility one to another. It is not a matter of judgment. It is a matter of adelphos, brotherly love.

Look at your own situation for a second. You are not a member of a local church. Ergo you are not under pastoral oversight. It is a hard thing to live as a Christian without accountability. And I am not pointing the finger at you. I need the same accountability. I need others to be concerned for my soul and to correct me (in love) if I stray.

What's your point? I sit under 3 very capable beings brother and they love me and teach me and correct me all the time. Never fear God is with me wherever I go.

 

[Reformed]

What's your point? I sit under 3 very capable beings brother and they love me and teach me and correct me all the time. Never fear God is with me wherever I go.

But you are willfully neglecting the local church. Only the local church has the authority to administer the ordinances. Only the local church has the authority to administer church discipline. Paul wrote three letters (1 & 2 Timothy and Titus) on local church issues. In 1 Timothy 4:11 Paul charges Timothy to, "Prescribe and teach these things" within the local church. Meeting privately, even with three capable brothers, is no substitute for the God-ordained local church. I am sorry, but that I have to state this plainly and clearly. I also understand that some people have been injured in a previous church experience. That may or may not be your situation. But even if it is I encourage you not to forsake the assembling of yourselves together (Hebrews 10:25) in the local church. Not only do you need it, but your brothers and sisters in Christ need your ministry to them.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

But you are willfully neglecting the local church. Only the local church has the authority to administer the ordinances. Only the local church has the authority to administer church discipline. Paul wrote three letters (1 & 2 Timothy and Titus) on local church issues. In 1 Timothy 4:11 Paul charges Timothy to, "Prescribe and teach these things" within the local church. Meeting privately, even with three capable brothers, is no substitute for the God-ordained local church. I am sorry, but that I have to state this plainly and clearly. I also understand that some people have been injured in a previous church experience. That may or may not be your situation. But even if it is I encourage you not to forsake the assembling of yourselves together (Hebrews 10:25) in the local church. Not only do you need it, but your brothers and sisters in Christ need your ministry to them.

There is no local church.