New Testament Quotations of the Old Testament

[Saved-By-Grace]

Please post any New Testament quote from the LXX Apocrypha.

not the point. IF, you accept that the LXX is Inspired as the Hebrew OT and Greek NT are, in the originals, than what of these books. The RCC say that they are, and by your own reasoning, you also agree with them!

 

[John of Japan]

your own words in #62

"On the other hand, if you are asking whether or not the LXX quotes in the NT should be considered by us to be inspired, my answer is "Yes."

Do you understand plain English? Because that is what I used in that statement. I did not say, "The LXX is inspired," which you are accusing me of. (Do you understand the use of the definite article in English?)

I see three possibilities. (1) You don't understand plain English, so maybe English is your second language, or maybe you didn't pay attention in high school English class. (2) You are deliberately twisting my words for some nefarious purpose of your own. (3) You don't believe in the inspiration of the NT.

 

[TCassidy]

I agree, we cannot decide if a translation is inspired , if so then which one or which not

But God can. When God quotes from a translation we can be assured that quote is inspired.

We have to say the original languages, what ever they are, are the only inspired scriptures.

They are, for the Old Testament, Hebrew with some Aramaic. For the New Testament Greek with some Aramaic and even a little (very little) Latin.

 

[TCassidy]

not the point.

Exactly the point. Which you seem to keep missing.

IF, you accept that the LXX is Inspired as the Hebrew OT and Greek NT are, in the originals, than what of these books.

Nobody has made such a claim. You can't just make this stuff up as you go along.

The RCC say that they are, and by your own reasoning, you also agree with them!

That is a lie. Shame on you!

 

[Saved-By-Grace]

Do you understand plain English? Because that is what I used in that statement. I did not say, "The LXX is inspired," which you are accusing me of. (Do you understand the use of the definite article in English?)

I see three possibilities. (1) You don't understand plain English, so maybe English is your second language, or maybe you didn't pay attention in high school English class. (2) You are deliberately twisting my words for some nefarious purpose of your own. (3) You don't believe in the inspiration of the NT.

so what are you answering yes to? Re-read what you said.

 

[John of Japan]

Indeed, ONLY the original languages are directly Inspired by the Holy Spirit, but there are some here who cannot grasp this. The quotes in the NT that agree with the LXX, are from a Hebrew text of manuscripts that are older than the MT, and in these places agree with the LXX. It is this Hebrew Bible that the NT writers quote from

Prove from the Hebrew OT that the supposed LXX quotes in the NT are really from the Hebrew, and by some miracle they turned out exactly like the LXX, even though done by different translators.

Also, what's the difference? If the NT quotes of the OT are from the LXX, they are from a translation, but if the NT quotes of the OT are from the Hebrew, they are still a translation. So the same problem remains either way: can a translated OT verse be inspired?

 

[Saved-By-Grace]

Exactly the point. Which you seem to keep missing.

Nobody has made such a claim. You can't just make this stuff up as you go along.

That is a lie. Shame on you!

in #71 you wrote, "If the New Testament quotes of the LXX are not inspired...". meaning exactly what?

 

[TCassidy]

When the New Testament quotes the Old Testament (which is a translation of Hebrew into Greek) is that quote inspired or not?

 

[TCassidy]

in #71 you wrote, "If the New Testament quotes of the LXX are not inspired...". meaning exactly what?

What part of "New Testament quotes" didn't you understand?

When the New Testament quotes the Old Testament, is that portion of the New Testament inspired or not?

 

[John of Japan]

so what are you answering yes to? Re-read what you said.

I wrote very plainly. I gave three possibilities for your accusation that I believe the LXX is inspired. Which of those is true? Are you purposefully twisting my words to falsely accuse me? (That is against the Ten Commandments.) Or do you just not understand plain English? Or do you deny the inspiration of the NT?

 

[TCassidy]

Can't you people read English? John is talking about the NT quotes from the LXX. This is what this discussion is all about!

Yes. And the New Testament is INSPIRED! Including the QUOTES!

 

[Saved-By-Grace]

Prove from the Hebrew OT that the supposed LXX quotes in the NT are really from the Hebrew, and by some miracle they turned out exactly like the LXX, even though done by different translators.

Also, what's the difference? If the NT quotes of the OT are from the LXX, they are from a translation, but if the NT quotes of the OT are from the Hebrew, they are still a translation. So the same problem remains either way: can a translated OT verse be inspired?

you accuse me of not understanding the English language? The OT Hebrew ORIGINAL is NOT a translation, but the direct Word of Almighty God given to the writers.Which is what I have been saying in plain English.

Do you have access to the DSS, or a study Bible with the DSS in the notes, or a book on the DSS? You will see that there is far greater agreement between the LXX and the DSS, than the LXX and the MT. So, here we have evidence of a Hebrew Bible that is the basis of the LXX text.

 

[Saved-By-Grace]

Yes. And the New Testament is INSPIRED! Including the QUOTES!

Again, for the 100 time! I have never said that it is NOT, so don't try to make me out to be someone that does. I am saying that these QUOTES are NOT from the LXX, but a Hebrew Bible of the original.

 

[Saved-By-Grace]

What part of "New Testament quotes" didn't you understand?

When the New Testament quotes the Old Testament, is that portion of the New Testament inspired or not?

but they are NOT from the LXX

 

[Saved-By-Grace]

I wrote very plainly. I gave three possibilities for your accusation that I believe the LXX is inspired. Which of those is true? Are you purposefully twisting my words to falsely accuse me? (That is against the Ten Commandments.) Or do you just not understand plain English? Or do you deny the inspiration of the NT?

"On the other hand, if you are asking whether or not the LXX quotes in the NT should be considered by us to be inspired, my answer is "Yes."

are these your words, or are you here quoting someone else?

 

[John of Japan]

you accuse me of not understanding the English language? The OT Hebrew ORIGINAL is NOT a translation, but the direct Word of Almighty God given to the writers.Which is what I have been saying in plain English.

For crying out loud, PAY ATTENTION. Whether the NT quotes of the OT are from the LSS or the Hebrew, THEY ARE TRANSLATED!!! And the NT is inspired, so those quotes are inspired. Or do you deny the inspiration of the NT, as has been asked you several times now?

Do you have access to the DSS, or a study Bible with the DSS in the notes, or a book on the DSS? You will see that there is far greater agreement between the LXX and the DSS, than the LXX and the MT. So, here we have evidence of a Hebrew Bible that is the basis of the LXX text.

Yes, I have BibleWorks with the DSS.

Let me ask you, just for information: do you read Hebrew and/or Greek?

 

[Saved-By-Grace]

But God can. When God quotes from a translation we can be assured that quote is inspired.

They are, for the Old Testament, Hebrew with some Aramaic. For the New Testament Greek with some Aramaic and even a little (very little) Latin.

But God did not, and you are just assuming that He did, with no evidence for this. There is a huge difference between the ORIGINALS and TRANSLATIONS. The former is directly Inspired by God the Holy Spirit, and the latter are NOT.

 

[Baptist Believer]

That's contrary to the great majority of scholars. Any proof?

I don't recall too much of the case, but the quotes from the LXX were part of it.

I don't place any stock in that theory. However, I am quite comfortable with the idea that Jesus was competent speaking all of the regional languages and dialects of His day.

 

[John of Japan]

"On the other hand, if you are asking whether or not the LXX quotes in the NT should be considered by us to be inspired, my answer is "Yes."

are these your words, or are you here quoting someone else?

Those are my words. So, do you understand the use of the English definite article? Apparently not. "The LXX" and "the LXX quotes" are not equivalent in meaning.

 

[Saved-By-Grace]

For crying out loud, PAY ATTENTION. Whether the NT quotes of the OT are from the LSS or the Hebrew, THEY ARE TRANSLATED!!!
And the NT is inspired, so those quotes are inspired. Or do you deny the inspiration of the NT, as has been asked you several times now?
Yes, I have BibleWorks with the DSS.

Let me ask you, just for information: do you read Hebrew and/or Greek?

Ah, now you have modified your response! you now say the quotes in the NT are from the LXX or Hebrew, which is not what you said earlier. I believe in the complete Inspiration of the entire 66 Books of the Holy Bible, but only in the ORIGINALS.

Answer to your question. Yes.