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Pope Francis: "Hell Does Not Exist"
- Thread starter InTheLight
- Start date
What was alleged to be the Pope's viewpoint has little to do with John Stott's view.
Both would hold to the lost being snuffed out and destroyed.
The Pope allegedly said that condemned souls just "disappear." There is no punishment mentioned in the Pope's alleged comments. There is also no appeal to the plain teaching of scripture like Stott has done.
Stott taught that the wicked would be consumed -- there would be punishment, but the suffering would not last forever -- according to the image of the lake of fire in Revelation. The text says clearly, "This is the second death."
A beautiful theory gets mugged by a gang of brutal facts. Fox News reports:
“What is reported by the author in today’s article is the result of his reconstruction, in which the literal words pronounced by the Pope are not quoted,” the Vatican said. “No quotation of the aforementioned article must therefore be considered as a faithful transcription of the words of the Holy Father.”
The Catholic News Agency reported that Scalfari has “misrepresented” the pope in the past. The agency reported that Scalfari “aslo falsely reported that Pope Francis had made comments denying the existence of hell in 2015.”
Vatican tamps down report that Pope Francis denies existence of hell
“What is reported by the author in today’s article is the result of his reconstruction, in which the literal words pronounced by the Pope are not quoted,” the Vatican said. “No quotation of the aforementioned article must therefore be considered as a faithful transcription of the words of the Holy Father.”
The Catholic News Agency reported that Scalfari has “misrepresented” the pope in the past. The agency reported that Scalfari “aslo falsely reported that Pope Francis had made comments denying the existence of hell in 2015.”
Vatican tamps down report that Pope Francis denies existence of hell
Second Death does NOT mean destroyed, but that their are apart from presence of God forever, as in being ruined., edtrnal life oin Scriptures not just living forever, but the quality of life, as being with god forever.
Joseph shall add
Member
Isaiah 66
22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain.
23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord.
24 And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh.
They are looking into hell, at peoples being burned being burned. We will see this every 15 to 30 days for all time.
22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain.
23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord.
24 And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh.
They are looking into hell, at peoples being burned being burned. We will see this every 15 to 30 days for all time.
(1) Did you notice that the scripture is taking about carcasses, not people who are alive? There is no suffering in this passage.
(2) The “worm” (maggot) does not die because it goes to the next stage of its life cycle. It turns into a fly.
(3) The fire is not “quenched” (that is, action is taken to extinguish it), but it can certainly go out because of lack of fuel.
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Joseph shall add
Member
The worm spoke of here is there soul, thus it is addressed there worm. Not maggots. The un-quenched fires is the fire of hell. And the people that are going to see them every month are the saved. At every sabbath for all of Christ 1000 years the saved will go and look upon those whom are in hell, then come and worship before the Christ, and they shall know that they were spared from by his suffering.
If you want to ignore every part of the text that doesn’t support your viewpoint, then I guess you could have that interpretation.
I’m just going to stick with the plain meaning of the words. That’s always served me quite well.
Why did the pope wait so long to tell us!?
Joseph shall add
Member
Never read the plain meaning of the word, study the word in relationship to the whole of Gods prefect word. Christ went to Hell, that the saved need not spend eternity in Hell. Thus he has paid the captives way out of Hell. All whom die with out Christ gift go to hell. The simple fact is Isaiah 66 speaks of eternal punishment in hell for all unbelievers, It declares there physical body and there soul burns in hell in a un-quenched eternal fire. And the sabbath is eternal as well.
Then you would see that the same term used for duration of time for both heaven and hell means forever, eternal!
Actually, I do that. The full message of scripture is quite plain regarding this issue.
If the English word “hell” that you are using means “Hades - the place of the righteous and unrighteousness dead / the grave” like the original Greek word for those texts in the New Testament, then I agree.
Yes, we will have eternal life, eventually in our resurrected bodies again.
Yes, they will be in Hades I’m suffering until the final judgment, where they will be cast into the Lake of Fire and be consumed. That is the second death.
Actually it teaches capital punishment where they die (they cease sentience) and their bodies are consumed. They do not suffer in Isaiah 66 in the flames, because they are already dead. That’s the plain meaning.
Yes it is.
Go back and read everything Jesus said about eternal life. He — almost without exception — clearly contrasts it with perishing, death, and/or destruction.
Yes. The judgment has eternal consequences. It is capital punishment. They eternally cease to exist.
Joseph shall add
Member
Let me put it in a way you might understand it. I was put in hell once and God ask me a question while i was on fire. The question was do you think i can't send a christian to hell.
Joseph shall add
Member
I was not always obedient.
(1) You are asking me to take an experience you had over clear scripture. I won’t do that.
(2) You haven’t defined what you mean by “hell.” You cannot mean the lake of fire because we have not faced the final judgment.
(3) There is a possibility that you were in the evil part of Hades, but I am quite skeptical of all hell and heaven experiences because they tend to contradict each other and scripture.
Joseph shall add
Member
The book is Isaiah contain the whole Gospel. but the new testament also contains the Gospel. You might want to research these Scriptures.
Rev 21:8, burning in hell, Matthew 25:46 eternal punishment , Psalm:17 realm for the dead, Matthew 13:50 weeping in hell, Mark 9:43 fire never goes out. Jude 1:7 punishment of eternal fire. Proverbs 15:24 realm of the dead. Matthew 13:42 blazing furnace, 2 Thessalonians 1:9 is the best one.
I find it interesting that you put no stock in he personnel experiences that people have with God. Yet you read a book full of personnel experiences that people had with God. You might want to think about that. Meanwhile people have personnel experiences with the Lord all day. I find it strange with a person whom claims to be a christian is tell people there is not hell when the bible plainly declares it over and over and over and over.
Rev 21:8, burning in hell, Matthew 25:46 eternal punishment , Psalm:17 realm for the dead, Matthew 13:50 weeping in hell, Mark 9:43 fire never goes out. Jude 1:7 punishment of eternal fire. Proverbs 15:24 realm of the dead. Matthew 13:42 blazing furnace, 2 Thessalonians 1:9 is the best one.
I find it interesting that you put no stock in he personnel experiences that people have with God. Yet you read a book full of personnel experiences that people had with God. You might want to think about that. Meanwhile people have personnel experiences with the Lord all day. I find it strange with a person whom claims to be a christian is tell people there is not hell when the bible plainly declares it over and over and over and over.
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
Just not true in real life since we believe in the Bible hell - the 'Lake of Fire" as John calls it in Rev 20 -- real fire and brimstone, real wicked "destroyed both body and soul in fiery hell" Matt 10:28 - in torment.