May God Bless
-
Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
Should I tithe?
- Thread starter evangelist6589
- Start date
- Status
May God Bless
In SC $14 is actually quite good, but in Colorado its what you say. It is FT and I do get some OT. However I have my wife whom makes better.
Grace to You definitely can get a blessing from me. Mac has worked hard and long and given me so much. He deserves financial support.
14 an hour with kids does not last long.
On a single income.
I am not convinced that it is a NT requirement. It was under the OT Law. 10% belonged to God. But in the NT, everything we have and everything we are belongs to God. In the NT we are commanded to give abundantly out of a cheerful heart. I think that if we observed NT offerings we would most likely be giving more than 10% of our income and time, but not out of compulsion.
I do think that this giving is even more important when it is not done out of our abundance. Sacrificial giving is often a measure of faith in divine provision.
If we are going to argue that the tithe is not for us now then we need to take up legitimate arguments. The tithe existed long before the law did.
As I said earlier- the tithe predates the giving of the law so it is not a "law thing" that passed away with the OT.
Secondly, the LAW has not passed away either- only the ceremonial parts of it that pointed to Christ and that Christ fulfilled.
The civil parts of it were NEVER for the rest of the world and only for Israel in the land of Israel, so they obviously don't apply to us (e. g. taking eggs from a wild bird's nest, etc...)
The rest is God's moral law and it is as applicable today as it ever has been.
But even if you are antinomian and you think we have no law today, you still have to account for the fact that the tithe predated the law.
The tithe was never ALL you were expected to give. Everything belonged to the Lord as much in the OT as it does in the NT and God said to not give above the tithe was robbery in the OT.
So why would the tithe not still be the minimal amount one is expected to give?
You should always give to your local assembly first.
One example is the Council of Jerusalem came to agreement of what would be required of Gentile Christians. The tithe is not mentioned as something that Gentile Christians are obligated to do.
Acts 15:22-35
As I mentioned before, the tithe is clearly a biblical principle and I would never argue that is bad or wrong. And while there is an example of the tithe that predates the law (Abram giving a tenth of the spoils of war and other people's stuff to the priest-king Melchizaeek), the tithe was thoroughly codified in the mosaic law. Plus using the argument that the tithe predates Mosaic law and thus is still a requirement for gentile Christians can be used perhaps even more effectively to defend the requirement to continue circumcision (also predates the law) and strict observance of the Sabbath on the 7th day (whenever that is). The Sabbath predates all. The God of all creation even observed the Sabbath. Very few Baptist observe a strict Sabbath. Also, the Sabbath even appears in the ten commandments -- God's moral law. The tithe didn't make the list.
I realize none of that is new. But that is a short answer on why I do not believe Gentile Christians are stealing from God if they do not get the accounting exactly right and give a 10th of their increase....not gross...increase. As others stated before on this thread the new testament model for giving would lead many to give more than 10 percent anyway.
The Council of Jerusalem was not about what moral laws the Gentiles should uphold.
It was about what ceremonial laws should be observed.
For example, the Jerusalem Council did not condemn idolatry- but Paul did late on.
The JC did not condemn adultery but Paul did.
The moral law has never been abrogated.
Since tithing predates Moses by four hundred years at least, we can know that it was not either ceremonial or civil law.
God has always expected at least a tenth from those who believe in him.
We do continue it in the form of baptism. Baptism is the NT version of OT circumcision.
We do observe the Sabbath on Sunday due to the resurrection of Christ on Sunday.
The NT model is no more demanding than the OT model. God has always required that men worship him as the giver of all they have and that they recognize him in all they do and have.
Inspector Javert
Active Member
The "tithe"....as a teaching does not "pre-date" the giving of the Law.
It is no where mentioned before the flood. Provided we assume 6,000-10,000 years of human history beginning from Genesis 1, at least the first 1/3rd of human existence has ZERO account of a "tithe". Adam is not said to have "tithed" ditto Seth, ditto Noah....ditto Shem etc.
Abraham is never said to have "tithed" if that is defined as regularly giving 1/10th of his income...he "tithed" 10% of spoils to Melchizedek........SPOILS, not income. He paid of his men and NEVER kept the rest. That was a one time event off of spoils of war.
Isaac is never said to have tithed.
Jacob- (not "Israel") made a very conditional vow of trying to bargain for God's help. This was not an act of loving worship. Jacob has just fled from having deceived his brother and stolen his blessing. He is simply being the deal-maker and shrewd bargainer that he always had been.
There is no Scriptural evidence that Jacob actually kept this vow, but it is likely he did. Some Jewish tradition holds that he gave 10% of his wealth to the poor (where else would it go, the Temple?).
There is no mention of anyone else tithing before or after that for the next 400-ish years after the Israelites came into Egypt. Only Jacob's Conditional bargaining with God. Tithing is nowhere then mentioned until after they actually arrive in the Holy Land.
If you are going to teach your flocks to follow Abraham's and Jacob's example....than you are to teach them that promising a "tithe" is something you can use as a bargaining chip, that Abraham gave only once, (kept none of the rest) and only off of the spoils of war.
If tithing were a "moral principle" than why does fully one-third of human history pass with no mention of this eternal timeless principle?
New Testament early Christians did not "tithe".......they gave EVERYTHING they had to each other and the work of God and shared all in common. Decidedly, we are to give of our time, our talents and our money to the work of the Lord, but this has nothing to do with a percentage "tithe".
On a side note..."first-fruits" are not "tithes", and they never were. "First-fruits" went directly to the Temple, and could be carried in a single basket. They were for presently ministering Priests only and not the Levites. "First-fruits" and the "first-born" offerings were not part of the tithe or counted as tithe in any way. They are un-related. TITHES went to the Levitical cities.....not the Temple, and were for BOTH the Levites and the Priests...The Levites, not the people brought portions of the tithe from the Levitical cities to the Temple.
It is no where mentioned before the flood. Provided we assume 6,000-10,000 years of human history beginning from Genesis 1, at least the first 1/3rd of human existence has ZERO account of a "tithe". Adam is not said to have "tithed" ditto Seth, ditto Noah....ditto Shem etc.
Abraham is never said to have "tithed" if that is defined as regularly giving 1/10th of his income...he "tithed" 10% of spoils to Melchizedek........SPOILS, not income. He paid of his men and NEVER kept the rest. That was a one time event off of spoils of war.
Isaac is never said to have tithed.
Jacob- (not "Israel") made a very conditional vow of trying to bargain for God's help. This was not an act of loving worship. Jacob has just fled from having deceived his brother and stolen his blessing. He is simply being the deal-maker and shrewd bargainer that he always had been.
There is no Scriptural evidence that Jacob actually kept this vow, but it is likely he did. Some Jewish tradition holds that he gave 10% of his wealth to the poor (where else would it go, the Temple?).
There is no mention of anyone else tithing before or after that for the next 400-ish years after the Israelites came into Egypt. Only Jacob's Conditional bargaining with God. Tithing is nowhere then mentioned until after they actually arrive in the Holy Land.
If you are going to teach your flocks to follow Abraham's and Jacob's example....than you are to teach them that promising a "tithe" is something you can use as a bargaining chip, that Abraham gave only once, (kept none of the rest) and only off of the spoils of war.
If tithing were a "moral principle" than why does fully one-third of human history pass with no mention of this eternal timeless principle?
New Testament early Christians did not "tithe".......they gave EVERYTHING they had to each other and the work of God and shared all in common. Decidedly, we are to give of our time, our talents and our money to the work of the Lord, but this has nothing to do with a percentage "tithe".
On a side note..."first-fruits" are not "tithes", and they never were. "First-fruits" went directly to the Temple, and could be carried in a single basket. They were for presently ministering Priests only and not the Levites. "First-fruits" and the "first-born" offerings were not part of the tithe or counted as tithe in any way. They are un-related. TITHES went to the Levitical cities.....not the Temple, and were for BOTH the Levites and the Priests...The Levites, not the people brought portions of the tithe from the Levitical cities to the Temple.
Last edited by a moderator:
Economy is half the battle of life; it is not so hard to earn money as to spend it well. (Charles Haddon Spurgeon)
Source: http://dailychristianquote.com/dcqmoney.html
Tithe what you can with a clear heart and with the right motivation. Amount makes no difference.
Source: (My personal opinion) :thumbsup:
Source: http://dailychristianquote.com/dcqmoney.html
Tithe what you can with a clear heart and with the right motivation. Amount makes no difference.
Source: (My personal opinion) :thumbsup:
Should I tithe? A question that should be answered by everyone as yes.
Here is my belief:
- The first 10% or more goes to God
- The second 10% or more goes into savings and investments
The savings and investments are for two purposes:
- So no one will have to care for me financially when I am old and infirmed.
- So I can help others that God brings into my life that are in need.
It does not matter if you believe there is a command in the NT or not. In fact, does not following Christ demand our all? How can I say I am willing to give all if I am not willing to give 10%? Just curious.
Do I love God so little, and my fellow Christians so little that I will not give?
There is no NT tithe precept but there is one concerning giving:
2 Corinthians 9
2 Corinthians 9
2 Corinthians 9
6 But this I say, He which soweth sparingly shall reap also sparingly; and he which soweth bountifully shall reap also bountifully.
7 Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver.
7 Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver.
The OT tithe was for citizen landowners and their agricultural gain.
It was to be brought to the Israeli capitol Jerusalem. It was an income tax.
It was to be brought to the Israeli capitol Jerusalem. It was an income tax.
The OT tithe was to be paid in kind - 20 new sheep - 2 went to the Lord (and any firstborn males) brought to the temple or a levite in your neigborhood.
There were conditions which excused you from the OT tithe but then you had to redeem the tithe and use the money for a celebration and you were required to invite priest(s).
Laborers were not required to tithe.
We (NT believers) in fact own nothing, everything we have is from our father in heaven and is His anyway.
We are not under the law but under the guidance of the Holy Spirit.
Galatians 5:18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.
While the NT does not command tithing neither does it forbid it (as long as the 2 Corinthians precepts aren't ignored).
So look again at the passage in 2 Corinthians
2 Corinthians 9
6 But this I say, He which soweth sparingly shall reap also sparingly; and he which soweth bountifully shall reap also bountifully.
7 Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver.
7 Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver.
There are other precepts for giving:
Faith - The just shall live by faith.
God's glory - 1 Corinthians 10:31 Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God.
When you give an account of the deeds done in the body it will be to God and not anyone here at the BB.
It is your decision.
HankD
Thats what I plan to do. Grace To You deserves my support as do other ministries.
should always give first tot he Lord, but would see it as proprtional to how he has blessed you, and God knows with what attitude offering it back to Him with!
You may be right. I am not sure, however, that “first fruits” and even the tithe of Abraham to Melchizedek qualifies as establishing the tithe (as a requirement of 10% belonging to God) before Leviticus.
I think that it may be appropriate to support your local church before supporting other ministries.
yes, as we are to bring it to the local church, and "offerings" to other ministries!
- Status