Sixty Days of Jail Time for Backyard Bible Study

[targus]

He didn't lie. Those claiming he lied are the ones who are telling the lies. It was what he said it would be. It was not a church.

Did you even listen to the video?

He said that he told them that it was going to be a "game room" and then he furnished it as a church.

It's right in the very first minutes of the video.

Anyone can play it and hear it.

He flat out admitted his lie.

Why are YOU defending a LIAR?

 

[targus]

Just listened to the first couple of minutes again.

He says he got a permit for a "game room" for "private use".

He then says that he furnished the 2,000 sq ft building with a "pulpit" and chairs for worhsip. "Just like you would see in any Christian building of worship".

He built a church - he says so himself in every word that he says other than calling it a "church".

 

[freeatlast]

Did you even listen to the video?

He said that he told them that it was going to be a "game room" and then he furnished it as a church.

It's right in the very first minutes of the video.

Anyone can play it and hear it.

He flat out admitted his lie.

Why are YOU defending a LIAR?

My friend I would bet that your church has a Gym and they call it a fellowship hall to keep from paying higher insurance premiums. Does this mean that your Pastor, all the deacons, and the church are all liars and you are taking part in it or have you confronted them for their lies? He built a game room. This is private property and it is not against the law to use it for other things. Can he invite friends and family over for the holidays and use it as a dining room and for them to sleep in it or is that a violation also? If you hold he lied then your church is full of liars if they have Gym and call it anything other then a Gym to beat the insurance man out of what is rightly his, higher premiums. This is clearly about a city government violating the constitution trying to stop him from having bible studies.

 

[targus]

My friend I would bet that your church has a Gym and they call it a fellowship hall to keep from paying higher insurance premiums. Does this mean that your Pastor, all the deacons, and the church are all liars and you are taking part in it or have you confronted them for their lies? He built a game room. This is private property and it is not against the law to use it for other things. Can he invite friends and family over for the holidays and use it as a dining room and for them to sleep in it or is that a violation also? If you hold he lied then your church is full of liars if they have Gym and call it anything other then a Gym to beat the insurance man out of what is rightly his, higher premiums. This is clearly about a city government violating the constitution trying to stop him from having bible studies.

Apples and oranges. :laugh:

And you would lose your bet...

Because my pastor doesn't lie.

Your response above implies that yours does though...

And it implies that so would you.

 

[Havensdad]

There is no gestapo here.

The city told him he could have his bible studies with a large group of people but he needed an "A Occupancy" building which he was allowed to build on his property.

He LIED and told the city that he was building a "residential accessory building" for a GAME ROOM which is NOT an "A Occupancy" building.

That is why he is facing jail.

WHY DID HE LIE ???

Why are YOU supporting a LIAR?

Nowhere in the video did the man say he lied. What he built was a residential accessory building. He should be able to use it for whatever he wants to. Its none of the government's business.

People like yourself are the problem with this country. Always making excuses for government oppression.

 

[Salty]

a man gets 60 days in jai

a. was it for having a bible study
or
b. was it for not meeting code

Headlines can be so misleading

 

[Havensdad]

Apples and oranges. :laugh:

And you would lose your bet...

Because my pastor doesn't lie.

Your response above implies that yours does though...

And it implies that so would you.

Why are you saying he lied? Because his permit labeled the building an "Accessory building/game room"?

If that is why, you need to know that that is a legal designation for permitting purposes. He did not "lie" about anything. When you get a permit, the permit lists use codes. The use codes are not exhaustive; you have to choose the closest thing to what the building is going to be used for; i.e. "parking" "storage" "accessory building/game room" etc. Accessory building was the correct designation for what he was doing with the building. It designates a building which is not for daily use (like a bedroom or kitchen), but is considered an interior occupied building.

 

[freeatlast]

Nowhere in the video did the man say he lied. What he built was a residential accessory building. He should be able to use it for whatever he wants to. Its none of the government's business.

People like yourself are the problem with this country. Always making excuses for government oppression.

:thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:

 

[freeatlast]

Apples and oranges. :laugh:

And you would lose your bet...

Because my pastor doesn't lie.

Your response above implies that yours does though...

And it implies that so would you.

Are you saying that your church does not have a Gym?

 

[targus]

Why are you saying he lied? Because his permit labeled the building an "Accessory building/game room"?

If that is why, you need to know that that is a legal designation for permitting purposes. He did not "lie" about anything. When you get a permit, the permit lists use codes. The use codes are not exhaustive; you have to choose the closest thing to what the building is going to be used for; i.e. "parking" "storage" "accessory building/game room" etc. Accessory building was the correct designation for what he was doing with the building. It designates a building which is not for daily use (like a bedroom or kitchen), but is considered an interior occupied building.

He admitted in the video himself that he lied when applying for the building permit.

He said that the permit was for a "game room" and then furnished the building as a church.

It is fascinating to me that some are willing to defend his deception.

 

[targus]

Are you saying that your church does not have a Gym?

You really should learn to read with comprehension.

I said nothing about my church having a gym or not.

BTW - My church does not have a gym.

 

[freeatlast]

You really should learn to read with comprehension.

I said nothing about my church having a gym or not.

BTW - My church does not have a gym.

That is rare today, but the point is the same. Every church that has one calls it a fellowship hall or something else instead of a Gym to deceive the insurance company so they do not have to pay the elevated rates for a Gym.

 

[Havensdad]

He admitted in the video himself that he lied when applying for the building permit.

He said that the permit was for a "game room" and then furnished the building as a church.

It is fascinating to me that some are willing to defend his deception.

No he didn't. Are YOU deliberately lying? Quoting from the video:

"It was LABELED 'Accessory Building/Game Room-Private Use'"

That is a PERMIT CATEGORY. They don't have a box on the permit form that says "Bible study room." Again, you are deliberately smearing this man, and you should stop. Seriously. :tonofbricks:

 

[blackbird]

No he didn't. Are YOU deliberately lying? Quoting from the video:

"It was LABELED 'Accessory Building/Game Room-Private Use'"

That is a PERMIT CATEGORY. They don't have a box on the permit form that says "Bible study room." Again, you are deliberately smearing this man, and you should stop. Seriously. :tonofbricks:

I'm gonna disagree with the pastor's side of the story on the "Permit" zoning thing and then ask this question

Lets just suppose that he carries on with the meetings ----- OK -----disregarding the local government's request to cease----he's going along just fine until one day(Heaven forbid) there is a fire(not unheard of happening) and the congregation attempts to escape and ----- lets just say that 50% perish in the flames from direct fire/heat and smoke inhalation----and the other 50% (including the pastor) escapes unscathed

What sort of story is the pastor gonna have to cough up to satisfy the insurance company, wrongful death law firms and the local District Attorney????------I can tell you right now who the DA's gonna be siding with----and it won't be with this "I am the law unto myself" pastor!!

:wavey::type:

 

[freeatlast]

I'm gonna disagree with the pastor's side of the story on the "Permit" zoning thing and then ask this question

Lets just suppose that he carries on with the meetings ----- OK -----disregarding the local government's request to cease----he's going along just fine until one day(Heaven forbid) there is a fire(not unheard of happening) and the congregation attempts to escape and ----- lets just say that 50% perish in the flames from direct fire/heat and smoke inhalation----and the other 50% (including the pastor) escapes unscathed

What sort of story is the pastor gonna have to cough up to satisfy the insurance company, wrongful death law firms and the local District Attorney????------I can tell you right now who the DA's gonna be siding with----and it won't be with this "I am the law unto myself" pastor!!

:wavey::type:

What if the same senerio happend and this was over thanksgiving with guests. Should you be forbidden from havng them attend?

 

[Havensdad]

I'm gonna disagree with the pastor's side of the story on the "Permit" zoning thing and then ask this question

Lets just suppose that he carries on with the meetings ----- OK -----disregarding the local government's request to cease----he's going along just fine until one day(Heaven forbid) there is a fire(not unheard of happening) and the congregation attempts to escape and ----- lets just say that 50% perish in the flames from direct fire/heat and smoke inhalation----and the other 50% (including the pastor) escapes unscathed

What sort of story is the pastor gonna have to cough up to satisfy the insurance company, wrongful death law firms and the local District Attorney????------I can tell you right now who the DA's gonna be siding with----and it won't be with this "I am the law unto myself" pastor!!

:wavey::type:

I am with Freeatlast: What if this happened during the family's Thanksgiving dinner?

It is not "I am a law unto myself." It is standing up against local governments who are BREAKING THE LAW. The CITY is the one who is saying they are a "law unto themselves" and are breaking the law of the land (The Constitution).

 

[Scarlett O.]

A family's Thanksgiving dinner does not fall under the same municipal category as a church, mosque, Lion's Club hall, or DAR headquarters.

Most of these city ordinances that require permits and/or housing inspections are for "religious, fratenal, or non-profit" organizations. A large family of 40 having Thanksgiving dinner on Grandpa's farm doesn't qualify for that.

Think about this old adage that everyone knows. "If it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, then it is probably a duck."

This man - who calls himself a pastor - has a structure in which people meet weekly, sit in pews, and listen to him as he stands behind a pulpit giving Bible instruction.

That sounds like church to me.

And another thing - it may look to some of you here like a persecution, but a lot of times these things don't get looked into unless there is a complaint.

His neighbor complained. I don't know why. Is he a non-believer? A trouble-maker? Does he have a legitimate complaint? I don't know.

But the city has no choice once the complaint is made.

The man who IS housing and running a church in building on his property that is not up to code must comply with city regulations.

And I don't see why that's such a hard to thing to comprehend.

 

[Havensdad]

A family's Thanksgiving dinner does not fall under the same municipal category as a church, mosque, Lion's Club hall, or DAR headquarters.

Most of these city ordinances that require permits and/or housing inspections are for "religious, fratenal, or non-profit" organizations. A large family of 40 having Thanksgiving dinner on Grandpa's farm doesn't qualify for that.

Think about this old adage that everyone knows. "If it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, then it is probably a duck."

This man - who calls himself a pastor - has a structure in which people meet weekly, sit in pews, and listen to him as he stands behind a pulpit giving Bible instruction.

That sounds like church to me.

And another thing - it may look to some of you here like a persecution, but a lot of times these things don't get looked into unless there is a complaint.

His neighbor complained. I don't know why. Is he a non-believer? A trouble-maker? Does he have a legitimate complaint? I don't know.

But the city has no choice once the complaint is made.

The man who IS housing and running a church in building on his property that is not up to code must comply with city regulations.

And I don't see why that's such a hard to thing to comprehend.

So, its illegal to have a Bible study at your house? As soon as you are studying the Bible, or teaching, it is instantly a "Church"? ??!! That is RIDICULOUS.

I guess from your logic, a Super Bowl Party at someone's house would have to get a liquor license (since its a Bar), or a swimming pool party at someone's house has to have paid lifeguards (since it is a Public pool), and that Granny can't bake her neighbors cookies anymore without a license (since that is a bakery).

Commercial property designation requires PAYMENT for goods and services, and PAID STAFF, and is OPEN TO THE PUBLIC. NONE of those occur on this man's property.

The City is breaking the law and shredding the Constitution. Not only are they violating equal protection (since they said a party or other activity was fine...just not a bible study or "Worship service"...they are penalizing the man, not for number of people, but for the activity they are choosing to engage in), they are also violating the first amendment.

This country does not have a chance with person's such as yourself supporting Government oppression.

 

[billwald]

A million dollar insurance liability rider is cheap enough.

 

[Havensdad]

A million dollar insurance liability rider is cheap enough.

Cheaper than giving up freedom.