Yet demons tremble and believe
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The Atonement of Christ: What did it REALLY Achieve ?2
- Thread starter Brightfame52
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Brightfame52
Well-Known Member
Redemption is an act of God !
A fellow said once to me, that yes Jesus Christ has obtained Eternal Redemption for them, but that does not mean those who He died for receive it. How far from the Truth was that statement. Redemption requires action to be done by the one doing the redeeming or He has not accomplished redemption, He has not accomplished anything if those He died to redeem are not actually redeemed.
Lets look again at Heb 9:12
12Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.
The word redemption here is the greek word lytrōsis:
ransoming, redemption
2) deliverance, esp. from the penalty of sin
Notice that one of the definitions is deliverance from the penalty of sin.
The Eternal Redemption of Heb 9:12, for the US the writer Identifies himself with, as to whom Christ obtained Eternal Redemption, He has obtained for them Eternal Deliverance from the penalty of what their sins deserve.
Paul says like this in Eph 1:7
7In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;
All whom Christ died for, have Eternal Forgiveness, even when they are by nature as others children of wrath ! Thats because this forgiveness is according to the riches of His Grace !63
So one of the many acts that Christ obtained for them He died for is they all are Eternally delivered from the penalty of their sins, all of them, according to the Riches of His Grace, and this before they have any knowledge of it.
A fellow said once to me, that yes Jesus Christ has obtained Eternal Redemption for them, but that does not mean those who He died for receive it. How far from the Truth was that statement. Redemption requires action to be done by the one doing the redeeming or He has not accomplished redemption, He has not accomplished anything if those He died to redeem are not actually redeemed.
Lets look again at Heb 9:12
12Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.
The word redemption here is the greek word lytrōsis:
ransoming, redemption
2) deliverance, esp. from the penalty of sin
Notice that one of the definitions is deliverance from the penalty of sin.
The Eternal Redemption of Heb 9:12, for the US the writer Identifies himself with, as to whom Christ obtained Eternal Redemption, He has obtained for them Eternal Deliverance from the penalty of what their sins deserve.
Paul says like this in Eph 1:7
7In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;
All whom Christ died for, have Eternal Forgiveness, even when they are by nature as others children of wrath ! Thats because this forgiveness is according to the riches of His Grace !63
So one of the many acts that Christ obtained for them He died for is they all are Eternally delivered from the penalty of their sins, all of them, according to the Riches of His Grace, and this before they have any knowledge of it.
Brightfame52
Well-Known Member
More on Forgiveness in relation to Redemption !
As we continue to consider the Eternal Redemption Christ has procured for them He died for, we find that He has obtained for them Eternal Forgiveness, for His Death hath delivered them from the Penalty of all their sins. All who are such blessed shall receive a Knowledge [Spiritual] of their Forgiveness Lk 1:77
77 To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the remission of their sins,
Folks Forgiveness of sins is Salvation, a portion of it ! That means you never have to worry about dying in your sins Heb 8:12
12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.
When He says He will remember them no more, means He will never lay them to their Charge as to condemn them.
Acts 5:31
31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.
Israel here means His Chosen People, whether jew or gentile, again He will give them a Knowledge of their forgiveness of sins !
Lk 24:46-47
46 And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behooved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:
47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.
Forgiveness of sins should preached IN HIS NAME !
What does that mean , In His Name ? The word name here is the greek word onoma:
name: univ. of proper names
2) the name is used for everything which the name covers, everything the thought or feeling of which is aroused in the mind by mentioning, hearing, remembering, the name, i.e. for one's rank, authority, interests, pleasure, command, excellences, deeds etc.
3) persons reckoned up by name
4) the cause or reason named: on this account, because he suffers as a Christian, for this reason
The Ideal here is Repentance and Remission of sins have been accomplished by the Person and Work of Jesus Christ for His People. Both are given by Him on account of His finished work. In this scripture Repentance nor forgiveness of sins are 64 commands or duties, but procured and bestowed blessings because of Christ's Finished work. And all that He died for will receive from Him Repentance and the knowledge of the forgiveness of their sins, as Peter puts it in Acts 5:31 see also Acts 11:18 Where it's made clear that Gentiles are included in being given Repentance unto Life !
As we continue to consider the Eternal Redemption Christ has procured for them He died for, we find that He has obtained for them Eternal Forgiveness, for His Death hath delivered them from the Penalty of all their sins. All who are such blessed shall receive a Knowledge [Spiritual] of their Forgiveness Lk 1:77
77 To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the remission of their sins,
Folks Forgiveness of sins is Salvation, a portion of it ! That means you never have to worry about dying in your sins Heb 8:12
12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.
When He says He will remember them no more, means He will never lay them to their Charge as to condemn them.
Acts 5:31
31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.
Israel here means His Chosen People, whether jew or gentile, again He will give them a Knowledge of their forgiveness of sins !
Lk 24:46-47
46 And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behooved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:
47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.
Forgiveness of sins should preached IN HIS NAME !
What does that mean , In His Name ? The word name here is the greek word onoma:
name: univ. of proper names
2) the name is used for everything which the name covers, everything the thought or feeling of which is aroused in the mind by mentioning, hearing, remembering, the name, i.e. for one's rank, authority, interests, pleasure, command, excellences, deeds etc.
3) persons reckoned up by name
4) the cause or reason named: on this account, because he suffers as a Christian, for this reason
The Ideal here is Repentance and Remission of sins have been accomplished by the Person and Work of Jesus Christ for His People. Both are given by Him on account of His finished work. In this scripture Repentance nor forgiveness of sins are 64 commands or duties, but procured and bestowed blessings because of Christ's Finished work. And all that He died for will receive from Him Repentance and the knowledge of the forgiveness of their sins, as Peter puts it in Acts 5:31 see also Acts 11:18 Where it's made clear that Gentiles are included in being given Repentance unto Life !
No you're wrong I will not see the Judgement I will not be judged, because of my faith in Christ.
MB
Yes, but since the atonement is limited to a particular, called out, people, no one will not believe who enter the Kingdom. They will believe precisely because God has given them the gift of faith to believe.
So, you're 'special'. Different from the rest of us, right? No need for you to be judged like the rest of us:
10 For we must all be made manifest before the judgment-seat of Christ; that each one may receive the things done in the body, according to what he hath done, whether it be good or bad. 2 Cor 5
Brightfame52
Well-Known Member
Brightfame52
Well-Known Member
Then you understand me wrong, and you understan Lk 8:13 wrongly. The stony ground believer didnt understand the word he received, which is essential, nor did he bear fruit of spiritual faith. See it was only the good ground hearer that received the word in a regenerated heart and understood it, and consequently bear fruit Matt 13:23
23 But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.
The good ground is the saved person, the regenerated person, which the stony ground hearer wasn't, he was undegenerated. The most an unregenerate person can do, is receive the gospel with the natural heart and product a religion of dead unfrutiful works, and finally apostacized.
The atonement of Christ produces good ground hearers my friend.
I will not be judged for sins I've been forgiven for If you are judged it's because of your refusal to see the truth. If anyone is under grace they will not be judged. The Judgement is for the Lost.
You even posted the truth and then you deny it.
Heb 8:12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.
If God remembers them no more after being forgiven then how will he judge us?
MB
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Brightfame52
Well-Known Member
No not special the only ones to be judged for there sins are not saved. Why would God lie about forgiveness? The sins forgiven are forgotten by God.
MB
37818
Well-Known Member
Nevertheless, ". . . they hear,
receive the word with joy;
and these have no root,
which for a while believe, . . ."
Dave G
Well-Known Member
" But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;
21 yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended." ( Matthew 13:20-21 ).
" And these are they likewise which are sown on stony ground; who, when they have heard the word, immediately receive it with gladness;
17 and have no root in themselves, and so endure but for a time: afterward, when affliction or persecution ariseth for the word’s sake, immediately they are offended. " ( Mark 4:16-17 ).
Consider this:
If they genuinely believed, from the heart, then they would have continued in the faith.
Evidence of a heart that has been forever changed by the Lord is always manifested in those that He has made new creatures in Christ.
I agree that many, especially nowadays, say that they believed and did, for a time, "believe";
But like the Jews in John 6 who "believed" on Him and then when the Lord Jesus revealed more of the truth and most of them walked away,
There are "believers" who will walk away over the course of their lives after they have heard the word and believed it.
So, for a while I see that they did believe...
But as events progressed, they showed who they really were by not continuing to walk with Him no matter what He said.
Unlike Peter and some of the others when He asked them why they didn't leave, their "faith" was conditional... and depended upon Him teaching them things that they wanted to hear;
Not things that He wanted them to hear whether or not they "sounded good" to their ears.
According to Matthew 13,
The "wheat" are sown in His field by Him, and they produce true fruit.
The "tares" are sown in His field by His enemy, and they do not bring forth true spiritual fruit, neither do they remain ( or abide ) in the vine.
They whither and are cast forth as branches ( John 15 ).
According to Matthew 13, Mark 4 and Luke 8,
There are believers and there are "believers".
The ones who believe for a while and fall away, show themselves for what they really are by the act of apostatizing.
They stop following after Him and His words and go back, in their hearts, to following what they genuinely love in their unchanged / unregenerate hearts...
This present world and its ways.
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37818
Well-Known Member
The point is that they believed and were not saved.
Same with demons.
You right it seems Calvinist have no desire for truth.
MB
I just listened to this older sermon by Alistair Begg titled "A Call to the Unsaved Believer." You may find it interesting. It's from Romans 10, but applies here.
A Call to the Unsaved Believer - Archive - Truth For Life
Brightfame52
Well-Known Member
Sure but its meaningless
37818
Well-Known Member
Meaningless meaning what?
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