Understanding the NT re: eternal security

[AustinC]

The OP reveals a loss of salvation by NT verses/passages!
I have a very simple and logical question (of which I know the answer, BTW) ...

WHY do BACs insist on ignoring and/or rejecting
the NT warning verses/passages about losing salvation?

You certainly have a simple view that ignores context and the fullness of scripture. This instigates you to place yourself as the cause of both your salvation and your loss of salvation. God is merely a passive observer of your actions.

You become the neo-pharisee who attempts to gain heaven by works. I have a very important thing to tell you. You will fail to gain heaven and you will die in your sins as you attempt salvation by works.

 

[AustinC]

So the saved can continue in a life of sin and still get to heaven

That would be the mindset of a salvation by works proponent, which you clearly propose.

The elect, redeemed child of God cannot continue in a life of sin for the Father disciplines his children, but not those who are illegitimate children. The child of God will receive the rod of grace that works to sanctify him to eternity.

Why do you glory in humans and disregard the glorious work of God on his children's behalf? It's as if you are a self-centered, prideful person who is all about me, me, me. Do you not realize that it's all about God, God, God?

 

[AustinC]

Why don't we look at specifics instead of generalities?

If a non-believer is a habitual (unrepentant) adulterer he/she goes to hell.
If a BAC is a habitual (unrepentant) adulterer he/she goes to heaven.
Isn't the grace of God wonderful?

Not on My watch, the Lord says!

What an awful view of God and his grace. No wonder you are clueless. You have no concept of grace and only a concept of salvation by the law.

 

[AustinC]

As I read this thread, I am shocked by the pharisees who still preach salvation by works with no understanding of grace at all.

Such wolves are prowling among the sheep.

 

[George Antonios]

May not be as you think. Salvation can only be received by the mercy of God.

Well of course.

 

[George Antonios]

George, where do you think you see this?

Hebrews 3, 6, 10; James 2; Revelation 12, 17; etc.
Ask any guy that mistakenly thinks we can lose our salvation and he will be more than glad to show you dozens of verses.
And he will be right, and yet dispensationally wrong.

 

[George Antonios]

As I read this thread, I am shocked by the pharisees who still preach salvation by works with no understanding of grace at all.

Such wolves are prowling among the sheep.

To preach salvation by faith and works during this church age is indeed a grievous heresy to be condemned and contented against.

To preach salvation by grace through faith without the works of law during the tribulation will be a grievous heresy to be condemned and contented against.

 

[Iconoclast]

Hebrews 3, 6, 10; James 2; Revelation 12, 17; etc.
Ask any guy that mistakenly thinks we can lose our salvation and he will be more than glad to show you dozens of verses.
And he will be right, and yet dispensationally wrong.

These verses do not support your conclusion, only your speculation.

 

[Alan Gross]

These verses do not support your conclusion, only your speculation.

If you can lose that kind of 'salvation', then the best course of action would be to lose it, as soon as possible.

You Must Be Born Again.

 

[tyndale1946]

If you can lose that kind of 'salvation', then the best course of action would be to lose it, as soon as possible.

You Must Be Born Again.

If you could lose YOUR Salvation, could Jesus Christ have said this... "IT IS FINISHED!"... If it wasn't finished, would God have raised him from the dead?... I NEVER boast about my eternal security because of what I did but because of what he did for me, that I did not deserve!... Brother Glen

Just an added thought... You didn't birth yourself naturally and you didn't birth yourself spiritually either!

 

[Samuels]

As I read this thread, I am shocked by the pharisees who still preach salvation by works with no understanding of grace at all.

You don't understand that the new covenant is about salvation by grace,
but that grace may be rejected by continuing in a lifestyle of habitual sinning
(i.e. without repentance).

Obeying the Lord's commandments is NOT salvation by works,
but it is simply obedience!

John 14 ... Those who love Jesus will obey His commandments.
John 15 ... Those who are Jesus' friends will obey His commandments.

Does a person get to heaven who does NOT love Jesus?
Does a person get to heaven who is NOT His friend?
Ergo, does a person get to heaven who does NOT obey His commandments?
IMO, the answer is "NO" to all 3 questions.

For example, please check:
“… you are that one’s slaves whom you obey, whether
(slaves) of sin leading to (eternal) death, OR
(slaves) of obedience leading to righteousness” (Romans 6:16, NKJV)

To go to heaven, you must be considered to be righteous in God's eyes (not yours).
To be righteous in God's eyes, one must practice righteousness.
“Whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God” (1 John 3:10, NKJV)

 

[AustinC]

To preach salvation by faith and works during this church age is indeed a grievous heresy to be condemned and contented against.

To preach salvation by grace through faith without the works of law during the tribulation will be a grievous heresy to be condemned and contented against.

Thankfully God is not a dispensationalist. God is a covenant making God who always keeps his covenant.

Since Adam, all person's have been saved by grace. Faith has always been a gift given to those God has graciously saved.

You struggle with this because you have bought in to a modern day interpretation of the Bible that misses the forest because of the trees.

 

[Samuels]

If you could lose YOUR Salvation, could Jesus Christ have said this... "IT IS FINISHED!"

Jesus was saying that God's plan (and His purpose) for coming to earth was finished.
BTW, the above is Kindergarden talk ...
Jesus didn't come to earth; the Word came to earth (and became flesh).
Prior to the Incarnation ... the Triune Godhead was the Father, the Word, and Holy Spirit.

 

[George Antonios]

God is a covenant making God who always keeps his covenant.

Of course.

Since Adam, all person's have been saved by grace.

You've got to run through the trunks of a bunch of trees (verses) to get that.

Rom 3:21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;

Romans 3:26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

Gal 3:12 And the law is NOT of faith: but, The man that DOETH them shall live in them.

Gal 3:23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.

 

[Alan Gross]

You don't understand that the new covenant is about salvation by grace,
but that grace may be rejected by continuing in a lifestyle of habitual sinning
(i.e. without repentance).

Obeying the Lord's commandments is NOT salvation by works,
but it is simply obedience!

John 14 ... Those who love Jesus will obey His commandments.
John 15 ... Those who are Jesus' friends will obey His commandments.

Does a person get to heaven who does NOT love Jesus?
Does a person get to heaven who is NOT His friend?
Ergo, does a person get to heaven who does NOT obey His commandments?
IMO, the answer is "NO" to all 3 questions.

For example, please check:
“… you are that one’s slaves whom you obey, whether
(slaves) of sin leading to (eternal) death, OR
(slaves) of obedience leading to righteousness” (Romans 6:16, NKJV)

To go to heaven, you must be considered to be righteous in God's eyes (not yours).
To be righteous in God's eyes, one must practice righteousness.
“Whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God” (1 John 3:10, NKJV)

I would like to point out, "sinning", is mentioned in this post.

Otherwise, "sin" is not addressed.

 

[AustinC]

Of course.



You've got to run through the trunks of a bunch of trees (verses) to get that.

Rom 3:21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;

Romans 3:26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

Gal 3:12 And the law is NOT of faith: but, The man that DOETH them shall live in them.

Gal 3:23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.

You realize you just butchered Romans 3 and Galatians 3 like a toddler butchers a play-doh set.

Understand the Abrahamic Covenant in relation to the Sinai Covenant and you will realize what Paul is teaching. Unlike you, Paul actually understands God's covenants and teaches us how they apply. But you, you are stuck in a far fetched 19th Century story of dispensationalism that Paul would not recognize in the least.

 

[utilyan]

And so Jesus was asked what must one do to be saved, SO he walked up the mount and said "CAN'T,......Either God will pick you if he likes you OR he will damn you since he hated you since before the foundation, So Jesus stretched his arms forth among the crowd, smokem if you gottem and buckle up!"

 

[AustinC]

And so Jesus was asked what must one do to be saved, SO he walked up the mount and said "CAN'T,......Either God will pick you if he likes you OR he will damn you since he hated you since before the foundation, So Jesus stretched his arms forth among the crowd, smokem if you gottem and buckle up!"

As are we all, since what you wrote is coming from your own imagination, not from any Reformed doctrine of salvation. Your presentation is your own lie you have created as a means of serving your self. Would that you had eyes to see and ears to hear.

 

[1689Dave]

When I became born-again ...
I was totally OPEN with no pre-conceived false doctrines.
And now also ... I believe in no unscriptural doctrines, but
I believe in what the NT clearly teaches!

Some years ago, I collected approximately 20 NT passages
which clearly threaten the loss of salvation.
And there were quite a few more verses which hinted at this fact,
but which simply served to confirm the truth of the obvious 20.

But, do you think you’re going to hear this from most churches?
No way, Jose, because it is so unpopular that it would cause
a drop in attendance and, wait for it … a drop in tithes!
(Lots of tithes are required to pay church salaries, mortgages, etc.)

Change of subject ... It is critically important to be able to
RECONCILE the 2 groups of NT Scriptures, which are:
the so-called OSAS NT verses ...vs... those NT verses which oppose them.
This RECONCILIATION is accomplished by understanding:
the NT word "believe" must include obedience!
This is true because of the NT verses which state obedience is necessary.
Forget what some commentaries, even lexicons, might say …
because these are written by indoctrinated man, and not by God.
Please allow the Lord to speak the Truth for Himself through the NT.
No NT verses/passages are to be ignored and/or rejected.

True saving belief/faith demands more than
a simple belief in the John 3:16-type of verses.

I hope and pray that this will help some believers to understand
what the NT is supposed to be teaching us!

You cannot have saving faith if you think you can be lost.

 

[utilyan]

As are we all, since what you wrote is coming from your own imagination, not from any Reformed doctrine of salvation. Your presentation is your own lie you have created as a means of serving your self. Would that you had eyes to see and ears to hear.

What part did I get wrong? Forget the ad hominem.

Tell us exactly what is wrong with the content.