Heheh, have Skandy bump his poll to the surface; see if that suits more people than this one.
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What Side Of The Fence Are You?
- Thread starter kyredneck
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Heheh, have Skandy bump his poll to the surface; see if that suits more people than this one.
Heheh, have Skandy bump his poll to the surface; see if that suits more people than this one.
I suppose that is an option, but when folks run polls, they are usually trying to find out a certain answer.
Are you confident enough in this Skandy fellow to find the answers to which you seek?
You check it out:
http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?t=63587
Yes, I was actually curious as to what the ratio was between freewillers/arminians/synergists to sovereign gracers/calvinists/monergists here on this board. I'm now convinced that it could never be worded in such a way that pleases everyone. Also, IMO, to get the maximum participation the BB Admin would probably need to create the OP.
Not to change the subject, but exactly what do you have to do to start a poll here? I know when you click on "New Post" that there is a box at bottom that says, "Post a Poll" and asks the number of poll options, but exactly how do you write out the different poll questions or statements you want shown? I tried this in the past, but couldn't figure it out.
If anyone could explain I would appreciate it.
If anyone could explain I would appreciate it.
If memory serves me right, BEFORE submitting the OP, make sure you check the box for a poll and whatever else you can do before submitting the thread, then submit it as usual and follow the instructions. It's all self explanatory.
Well, thanks for trying, but I have done that. What I want to know is, where does a box pop up where you can ask your different poll questions? I have never seen that.
Create the op as you want to word it. Then make sure you check the box for a poll and state the number of options you want to include in the poll, then submit the new thread. You will then be asked to word the question and options. Just make sure you check the box for a poll and include the number of options you want in it BEFORE submitting the new thread.
Thank you very much.
Now I can't remember the question I wanted to ask the poll about a week or so ago. :tongue3:
Apparently I'm not the dense one, as that is a VERY minute definition of both doctrines. Man cannot regenerate himself, hence regeneration is monergistic. God requires faith of us, hence that is synergistic. Salvation is given to man upon meeting His requirements making salvation monergistic and synergistic. You can let God out of your box at any time now...
...and you have the nerve to call me dense. Please follow along. The poll I started clearly shows the regeneration preceding faith view in the minority, completely dismissing the point you were trying to make initially by posting it. The majority of believers are NOT calvinists, like I said.
You can start by giving better definitions in context of what you are asking...that's always a good start
You synergist definition is quite the strawman, as man doesn't "cooperate" in regeneration, it is completely an act of God. You really need to start reading the work of those not reformed to get better definitions and understanding of doctrines.
And this is not the poll you started. At the very least you should confine your typical snide knee-jerk quips to the correct thread.
I understand what Webdog is saying. If you asked me who regenerated me, I would say 100% God. I have no power whatsoever to regenerate myself.
But if you asked does man participate in his salvation I would say yes, we have to respond to God's invitation and believe on Christ.
So, if the question is regeneration, I would say monergism, but if you asked about salvation I would say synergism.
But if you asked does man participate in his salvation I would say yes, we have to respond to God's invitation and believe on Christ.
So, if the question is regeneration, I would say monergism, but if you asked about salvation I would say synergism.
Winman, you are a freewiller, right? YOU CHOSE TO BE REGENERATED, RIGHT? According to your theology you would've never been regenerated unless YOU CHOSE to be. Right?
Synergism: the doctrine that the human will cooperates with the Holy Ghost in the work of regeneration.
Did you vote in the poll?
Well, to tell you the truth, I was a kid and didn't understand anything about monergism or synergism. All I know is that the scriptures told me I was a sinner and the wages of sin is death, and that the scriptures also said that if I believe Jesus is the Son of God who died for me and rose from the dead and called on him I would be saved. So, I did what God said and called on Jesus.
But even then I understood that I had no power whatsoever to save myself, that belongs to God. But I understood if I came to Jesus he would regenerate me in his power.
I mean, I don't know how to do a valve job on my car (although I do understand how to do many minor repairs). When I take my car to the mechanic, I certainly don't try to take credit for his knowledge, skill, and work he does to repair my car. Do you?
To put it another way, look at the many people Jesus healed in scripture. I believe physical healing is just a picture of salvation.
Matt 9:27 And when Jesus departed thence, two blind men followed him, crying, and saying, Thou Son of David, have mercy on us.
28 And when he was come into the house, the blind men came to him: and Jesus saith unto them, Believe ye that I am able to do this? They said unto him, Yea, Lord.
29 Then touched he their eyes, saying, According to your faith be it unto you.
Now, you don't think for one second that these blind men believed they had any power to heal themselves do you?
No, but they had heard of Jesus healing many people and believed he could heal them. Their faith in Jesus is actually giving all credit to him for his power and ability.
At the same time, when you read of these healings, the people almost always came to Jesus. In the vast majority of cases he didn't approach people for healing, they approached him.
Matt 21: 14 And the blind and the lame came to him in the temple; and he healed them.
This is really an incredible verse when you think about it. It would seem almost impossible for the blind and lame to come to Jesus, but they figured out a way to get there. Perhaps they asked someone to guide them, perhaps they asked someone to carry them, but they had heard Jesus healed people and they believed he would heal them too if they could just find a way to get to him and ask him. And they were correct, Jesus did heal them.
And this shows that it is not wrong for a man to participate in his salvation, in fact, it is a sin if he does not.
Matt 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
Jesus said come unto me, so how could it be wrong to come unto him? It can't. The scriptures actually say the opposite, if we refuse to come to Christ he will not give us life.
John 5:40 And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life.
Calvinists and Doctrines of Gracers can say all they want that it is wrong for a man to come to Christ, I don't care. I choose to believe what Jesus said. Jesus is not going to condemn a man for obeying his very commandments.
Matt 9:27 And when Jesus departed thence, two blind men followed him, crying, and saying, Thou Son of David, have mercy on us.
28 And when he was come into the house, the blind men came to him: and Jesus saith unto them, Believe ye that I am able to do this? They said unto him, Yea, Lord.
29 Then touched he their eyes, saying, According to your faith be it unto you.
Now, you don't think for one second that these blind men believed they had any power to heal themselves do you?
No, but they had heard of Jesus healing many people and believed he could heal them. Their faith in Jesus is actually giving all credit to him for his power and ability.
At the same time, when you read of these healings, the people almost always came to Jesus. In the vast majority of cases he didn't approach people for healing, they approached him.
Matt 21: 14 And the blind and the lame came to him in the temple; and he healed them.
This is really an incredible verse when you think about it. It would seem almost impossible for the blind and lame to come to Jesus, but they figured out a way to get there. Perhaps they asked someone to guide them, perhaps they asked someone to carry them, but they had heard Jesus healed people and they believed he would heal them too if they could just find a way to get to him and ask him. And they were correct, Jesus did heal them.
And this shows that it is not wrong for a man to participate in his salvation, in fact, it is a sin if he does not.
Matt 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
Jesus said come unto me, so how could it be wrong to come unto him? It can't. The scriptures actually say the opposite, if we refuse to come to Christ he will not give us life.
John 5:40 And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life.
Calvinists and Doctrines of Gracers can say all they want that it is wrong for a man to come to Christ, I don't care. I choose to believe what Jesus said. Jesus is not going to condemn a man for obeying his very commandments.
Joshua 24:15 (King James Version)
15And if it seem evil unto you to serve the LORD, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD.
15And if it seem evil unto you to serve the LORD, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD.
How about this one? Reckon it would fly?:
I was:
A. active in determining my eternal destiny.
B. passive in determining my eternal destiny.
Skandelon
<b>Moderator</b>
Actually, I'm not sure that is a prefect representation of your position considering that activity, though effectually brought about, is still required for salvation.
God determines everyone's destiny, but the question is what does he base that determination on? Is it based upon the secret counsel of His divine will or upon our free response to his appeal to be reconciled?
(A) is the cause and (B) is the effect.
Skandelon
<b>Moderator</b>
I didn't think at this level of our discussion I would have to fully define the word "free" yet again. I wrongly assumed you would know that I was speaking of LFW...the ability to do otherwise.
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