Will the Jews build a new temple in Jerusalem?

[37818]

Jesus spoke face to face with those who were going to crucify Him.
He told them they would see Him coming in judgment....before they would die.They did

That is an apostate interpertation in my view. You didn't even cite your text.

[My view both the living and the unresurrected dead will see Christ when He suddenly appears. Hebrews 9:28, Matthew 24:27, Matthew 26:64, Revelation 1:7.]

 

[Iconoclast]

That is an apostate interpertation in my view. You didn't even cite your text.

That might be in your view, but then again it does not seem that you know what is going on.
Looks like you just oppose everything without considering the verses.
There are 3 or 4 verses that say what I said..
They have been posted so that tells me you are not reading the responses offered to you.

 

[Squire Robertsson]

They have been posted so that tells me you are not reading the responses offered to you.

May I suggest you use the same formulation the British Prime Minister uses in his\her question time in the House of Commons?

I refer my Right Honourable Colleauge to the answer I gave at #Xx​

 

[37818]

That might be in your view, but then again it does not seem that you know what is going on.
Looks like you just oppose everything without considering the verses.
There are 3 or 4 verses that say what I said..
They have been posted so that tells me you are not reading the responses offered to you.

You still did not provide your references.

I had added the follow comment

[My view both the living and the unresurrected dead will see Christ when He suddenly appears. Hebrews 9:28, Matthew 24:27, Matthew 26:64, Revelation 1:7.]

 

[Iconoclast]

That is an apostate interpertation in my view. You didn't even cite your text.

[My view both the living and the unresurrected dead will see Christ when He suddenly appears. Hebrews 9:28, Matthew 24:27, Matthew 26:64, Revelation 1:7.]

Your view is ignoring what the text says

You quote mt.24:27 as if it speaks of the second coming.
Open to Mt24...look at 29-30

Vs.30..after the tribulation described In.vs. 29
It says;
And then shall appear.....

What appears?

Is it Jesus returning physically?

No.

Then shall appear the SIGN....
The sign of what?

The sign.....of the Son of Man....
Where is He?

IN HEAVEN....do you see what it says?
THE SIGN OF THE SON OF MAN IN HEAVEN.
Jesus is in heaven....His coming in judgment....described assuming in the clouds of heaven.

 

[Iconoclast]

You still did not provide your references.

I had added the follow comment

I just answered you once again.
Read it slowly with your bible open to the passage.
Far from being an apostate view...it was held historically by many.
What matters is what it says...
The sign of the Son of man in Heaven.
Vs 34 says this generation shall not pass UNTIL ALL THESE THINGS COME TO PASS.

 

[Iconoclast]

You can see it in Luke 21:20-36
Vs32-33
Jesus warned them of the destruction of the temple,the destruction of Jerusalem. They listened and fled out when the city was surrounded.

 

[1689Dave]

that it was precisely replicated by the very created things we were told to use for sign and for season ... and this one hasn't been since mankind existed.

OH ... on the 70 AD question ... I missed how the antioch pig abomination told the first generation church to vacate Jerusalem by the year 70AD.

Wanna know how?

The Hebrew language has numerical association for every one of its letters. Can't prove it by me, but that's what I understand from those who are proficient in Hebrew ... not just "Hebrewese."

Well, I'll be dipped if Jesus' statement, "not a stone here will be left unturned" in Hebrew doesn't sum to ... 40.

While it may be a bit cryptic to us, it was right in the wheel house of those people during that time. IDK how much time passed before it became clear Jesus wasn't only predicting WHAT would happen to that structure ... but WHEN.

None means none, right? NO follower of Jesus was killed during the siege on Jerusalem by Titus.

There are many examples of type/shadow ... there are many examples of symbolism (parables/visions) ... and there are some literal things occurring.

Was it symbolic Jesus rode the donkey into Jerusalem? Or did He really ride a donkey into Jerusalem?

Much of what Jesus said did fulfill prophecy. You can keep the literal separate if you can spot its reference in the OT. When Jesus said he is the temple of God, it is literal for in Him dwells all of the fulness of God (the trinity) bodily. It depends on how much time you dedicate to OT studies.

 

[1689Dave]

that it was precisely replicated by the very created things we were told to use for sign and for season ... and this one hasn't been since mankind existed.

OH ... on the 70 AD question ... I missed how the antioch pig abomination told the first generation church to vacate Jerusalem by the year 70AD.

Wanna know how?

The Hebrew language has numerical association for every one of its letters. Can't prove it by me, but that's what I understand from those who are proficient in Hebrew ... not just "Hebrewese."

Well, I'll be dipped if Jesus' statement, "not a stone here will be left unturned" in Hebrew doesn't sum to ... 40.

While it may be a bit cryptic to us, it was right in the wheel house of those people during that time. IDK how much time passed before it became clear Jesus wasn't only predicting WHAT would happen to that structure ... but WHEN.

None means none, right? NO follower of Jesus was killed during the siege on Jerusalem by Titus.

There are many examples of type/shadow ... there are many examples of symbolism (parables/visions) ... and there are some literal things occurring.

Was it symbolic Jesus rode the donkey into Jerusalem? Or did He really ride a donkey into Jerusalem?

You are reading your ideas into Revelation and not learning what John is saying. It's called newspaper eisegesis. Hal Lindsey, the false prophet made millions doing this.

 

[Lodic]

Matt. 24:15 “So when you see standing in the holy place ‘the abomination that causes desolation,’ spoken of through the prophet Daniel—let the reader understand— 16 then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. 17 Let no one on the housetop go down to take anything out of the house. 18 Let no one in the field go back to get their cloak. 19 How dreadful it will be in those days for pregnant women and nursing mothers! 20 Pray that your flight will not take place in winter or on the Sabbath. 21 For then there will be great distress, unequaled from the beginning of the world until now—and never to be equaled again.
The AOD didn't occur between the times Jesus spoke those words & the destruction of the temple. But the AOD & those other events MUST & WILL occur. But there must be a temple for the AOD to occur in. These are backed up in 2 Thess. 2 & Rev. 13.

Thank you for giving me Scriptures that you believe support your view. You are presenting your interpretation of those passages, and now I will provide my interpretation of them.

In Matthew 24:15-21, Jesus is telling His immediate audience (you) that they will see the AOD that Daniel spoke of. When Jerusalem was surrounded by the Roman armies, they remembered what Jesus warned of and fled to the mountains of Pella (60 miles northeast of Jerusalem) to escape the tribulation. This escape was made possible when Cestius and his armies suddenly withdrew from the temple area. It would be impossible to escape a worldwide tribulation. In verses 16-20, Jesus refers to the strict Sabbath laws of 1st century Israel. The Christians would have been prohibited from traveling on the Sabbath due to the travel restrictions placed upon them by the religious leaders.

"Never to be equaled again" - you have used that phrase to defend your position many times. Jesus was using hyperbole. We see similar language used in Ezekiel 5:9, Daniel 9:12, and many other places.

Like you, I believe 2 Thessalonians 2 and Revelation 13 provide additional support for my view. The temple was still standing when 2 Thessalonians was written. Nero was the Man of Lawlessness. Likewise, Nero / the Roman Empire was the "Sea Beast" of Revelation 13.

Finally, we must remember that the Scriptures are inspired, but our views and interpretations are not.

 

[robycop3]

Anyone returning to animal sacrifice cannot be saved (Heb. 6). And Ezekiel's temple calls for real animal sacrifice. These people are possibly already lost even thinking about doing it.

Well, actually, Orthodox Jews have intended to do it for a long time, but that haven't had a place to do it. When the new temple is built, they'll resume it very quickly. And PETA won't be welcome or able to do anything about it.

This is not to bring salvation, but to fulfill prophecy.

 

[robycop3]

Thank you for giving me Scriptures that you believe support your view. You are presenting your interpretation of those passages, and now I will provide my interpretation of them.

In Matthew 24:15-21, Jesus is telling His immediate audience (you) that they will see the AOD that Daniel spoke of. When Jerusalem was surrounded by the Roman armies, they remembered what Jesus warned of and fled to the mountains of Pella (60 miles northeast of Jerusalem) to escape the tribulation. This escape was made possible when Cestius and his armies suddenly withdrew from the temple area. It would be impossible to escape a worldwide tribulation. In verses 16-20, Jesus refers to the strict Sabbath laws of 1st century Israel. The Christians would have been prohibited from traveling on the Sabbath due to the travel restrictions placed upon them by the religious leaders.

"Never to be equaled again" - you have used that phrase to defend your position many times. Jesus was using hyperbole. We see similar language used in Ezekiel 5:9, Daniel 9:12, and many other places.

Like you, I believe 2 Thessalonians 2 and Revelation 13 provide additional support for my view. The temple was still standing when 2 Thessalonians was written. Nero was the Man of Lawlessness. Likewise, Nero / the Roman Empire was the "Sea Beast" of Revelation 13.

Finally, we must remember that the Scriptures are inspired, but our views and interpretations are not.

The key phrase Jesus used is "LET THE READER UNDERSTAND." That PROVES His words are meant for many others besides His immediate audience, that is His disciples.

And His disciples did NOT see the AOD, as it still hasn't happened yet.

And Jesus was NOT using hyperbole. He answered the disciples' questions literally. And, had the great trib occurred then, Jesus is long-overdue, as He said He'd return IMMEDIATELY AFTER it was over.

Thus, there must be a new temple for the AOD to occur in. While declaring oneself to be God anywhere, any time is an abomination, Jesus was referring to ONE SUCH EVENT, which MUST take place in the temple in Jerusalem.

 

[Two Wings]

The key phrase Jesus used is "LET THE READER UNDERSTAND." That PROVES His words are meant for many others besides His immediate audience, that is His disciples.

And His disciples did NOT see the AOD, as it still hasn't happened yet.

And Jesus was NOT using hyperbole. He answered the disciples' questions literally. And, had the great trib occurred then, Jesus is long-overdue, as He said He'd return IMMEDIATELY AFTER it was over.

Thus, there must be a new temple for the AOD to occur in. While declaring oneself to be God anywhere, any time is an abomination, Jesus was referring to ONE SUCH EVENT, which MUST take place in the temple in Jerusalem.

I think we need to specify WHICH AOD.

I believe the AOD referenced in Daniel 12 is the dome of the rock. 1290 (years) from the cessation of the regular sacrifice (599BC in the 2nd Siege on Jerusalem which was known to Daniel/et al), will be the AOD standing in the holy place ... blessed is he who endures to the end 1335 (years)

Yes, there will be another AOD (actually I think there are at least 3) ... antichrist's stopping the recently renewed regular sacrifice 1/2 way through the 7 year confirmed covenant.

 

[Two Wings]

Jesus spoke face to face with those who were going to crucify Him.
He told them they would see Him coming in judgment....before they would die.They did

first sentence: totally agree.
second ... ??? Jesus has already come in judgement?

Then what are we doing here? Is this the millennial reign for a bonus millennium? I sure hope not.

 

[1689Dave]

first sentence: totally agree.
second ... ??? Jesus has already come in judgement?

Then what are we doing here? Is this the millennial reign for a bonus millennium? I sure hope not.

Jesus destroyed the Pharisee's Millennial Kingdom ideas if you pay close attention to the gospel of the Kingdom preached by Jesus in the gospels. But keep in mind, only the born-again can see it.

 

[Iconoclast]

first sentence: totally agree.
second ... ??? Jesus has already come in judgement?

Then what are we doing here? Is this the millennial reign for a bonus millennium? I sure hope not.

He did not physically come to earth.
The language indicates He came.in the form of judgment upon apostate Jerusalem. The theocracy was ended.
Jesus rules in the midst of His enemies.

 

[Two Wings]

Jesus destroyed the Pharisee's Millennial Kingdom

perhaps, but why would He tell John in the very book titled Revelation ... if there isn't a literal 1000 year reign on this rock as it is (Valley of Meggido cleaned-up by the remaining Jews during the 7 year wedding feast/bema seat in Heaven) ...

then what is our reference?

I'm no Jewish scholar, so perhaps your categorizing "Pharisee's Millennium" is not the one Jesus said would happen with His heirs and the one I reference (and the period referenced in this thread)

 

[Two Wings]

The language indicates He came.in the form of judgment upon apostate Jerusalem.

Copy that ... but we're discussing the literal Return of Christ ... the establishment of the reign of Christ prior to the eternal dispatching of Satan, after Jesus' Second Coming/Wrath of The Lamb.

 

[37818]

IN HEAVEN....do you see what it says?
THE SIGN OF THE SON OF MAN IN HEAVEN.
Jesus is in heaven....His coming in judgment....described assuming in the clouds of heaven.

Acts of the Apostles 1:11, ". . . Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven. . . ." Hebrews 9:28 there is only one second appearing, ". . . unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time . . . ." And 1 John 3:2 has not happened yet.

 

[37818]

I just answered you once again.
Read it slowly with your bible open to the passage.
Far from being an apostate view...it was held historically by many.
What matters is what it says...
The sign of the Son of man in Heaven.
Vs 34 says this generation shall not pass UNTIL ALL THESE THINGS COME TO PASS.

Even though the pre-millennium [Revelation 20:4-6] is not one of the 5 tenets given as "fundamentalism" it is explicitly a fundamental of the faith as the second appearing of Christ. And what "This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled" are referring to what are cited to be seen in Matthew 24:29-31. And that one event is yet future. Hebrews 9:28, 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17, 1 Corinthians 15:52.