Featured Did Christ Atone for ALL humans?

Robert, I would not have used that expression if I were you. See most people (I have observed) have been raised up in some type of religion or another & they naturally carry over their understanding based off of what they have learned.

For example, around me are 3/4 of church goers are Roman Catholic. My mother was an Italian & therefore my religion was RC & I was raised to believe God loves everyone & everyone is given a fair chance to redeem themselves. They even taught that you could be a heinous sinner right up until your death bed but if you repent & say a sincere prayer than you go to heaven. Of course you might need to go to Puratory for a while to burn off your sins but generally you are not going to hell. But that's another story.

Most of the mainline "Protestant" beliefs have some carry over from momma church .....even Calvin continued its practice to a certain degree. And I can see how easy it is to slip back into synergistic beliefs.....after all we all want to have some semblance of control over our life choices so why not build that into our religion as well.

You will note, or maybe you have not been here long enough, that there are some people here who have been on that religious journey for a while & they transform as they go.....most develop more into Sola Gratia, Doctrines of Grace believers with time (of course some do not....but that is by choice). Scripture eventually persuades most to believe in the complete sovereignty stance (which is the minority position---especially today)....but we are all moving along at a pace that God provides. I am 58 YO & 6 years ago I was pretty much a non believer. And I have thankful with the illumination he has provided to me. So I really am cautioning you to be patient....see its really not in your hands or mine, but God's.

 

And I would say that you are seriously mistaken about both of them, particularly prevenient grace.

 

You beat me to it. :thumbsup:

 

dont just make accusing statements man, prove it out.....explain your position in detail & show the guy where he is wrong.

 

I'll try when I get more time. I'm at work and hollering at kids.

 

I care --and so have countless others for centuries. He had biblical wisdom with which we should avail ourselves.

We should care what numerous Christians have taught throughout the Church Age. To ignore them or think we know better is a sure mistake. I am not only referencing John Calvin. Augustine, Wycliffe, Luther, Bucer, Turretine, Owen, Goodwin, Bunyan, Haldane, Spurgeon, Ryle, AWP, BBW,Dr.M-L-J, and so many others from the past -not to mention scores of others from the present.

We should read with discernment, but far be it from us to dismiss God-given giants who can help us in our spiritual development.

 

Believe it or not, some people actually have to work for a living. When I have time, I'll post in greater detail.

 

Better be prepared to wait several hours. I teach, and that's enough of an explanation.

 

IMO, your scripture is way out of context. That won't matter to a Calvinist though. Show me one place in the first chapter of Ephesians where the chapter is speaking of:
1. Predestination of a select few to salvation, and,
2. the reprobation of the rest to an eternity in the Lake of Fire.

In this chapter Paul is teaching of the predestination of the blessings that the elect have because they are in Christ. It is always addressed to those who are "in Christ." We have many blessings because we are "in Christ," and they are enumerated here."
It is not speaking about about being predestinated before the foundation of the world unto salvation. Where does it say that here.

And on what basis does God predestine one to salvation and others to reprobation (randomly? "eeny-meeny-miny-mo"?). Or does He have a judicial method of selection. Of course he does.

1Pe 1:2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.
--He has elected us according to His foreknowledge.
Let's not redefine foreknowledge. It is just what it says it is--knowing aforetime or ahead of time, similar to His omniscience.
He knew before the foundation of the world who, of their own free will (which, within the boundaries of his Sovereignty, he has allowed man) who would receive him or reject him. On that basis he chose those that received him and damned those that rejected him. God is just. He is fair. He lives outside the boundaries of time and is able to see the end from the beginning--knowing what man has done before he does it.
He is not a scatter-brained God as the Calvinist portrays Him that randomly selects some for salvation and simply damns the rest for eternity. He is just and has a definite reason. People who end up in hell do so because they themselves have rejected Christ.

 

There is predestination in those verses, just not the kind that Calvin teaches. Those that follow the teachings of Calvin are following erroneous teachings.
Show me where predestination to salvation and election to damnation or reprobation are taught in those verses instead of apologizing to me.

 

Jesus also taught that you should love your enemies...and that's about as radical as your gonna get. On Sunday, a Baptist Pastor started his sermon with ....."Christ died for all" .....I wanted to walk out. See Id already confronted him with that ....but I held my tongue. I will have coffee with him in the next few & he will hear it again though LOL! :thumbs:

Gotta love them :love2:

 

Just curious, but if Christ did not die for all, then how do you evangelize? How do you preach atonement if you do not believe Jesus atoned for all? In order to be honest to yourself and God, you would have to tell a congregation that there are those among you that Christ did not die for, and that He never meant to even offer grace to, and had no intention of saving. That's not a theology I see revealed in the scriptures.