Featured Where does faith come from? 2nd Rodeo

It is what we do that will decide if we are redeemed. Salvation is not some magical blessing that God sprinkles on some and not others. Our fate, our reward is in our hands.


20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

 

Some of us have come to understand this differently.
2 Tim 1:9 indicates God had already purposed to correct and redeem a multitude of sinners in Himself.
The only works that can save us is the perfect life,active obedience, and Cross work of the Son.
If we are the objects of His love and mercy....the good works you speak of will be manifest as God works in and through us.

If you are suggesting it is all what we do....on our own, we would be doomed.
By the deeds of the law there will be NO FLESH justified in His sight.

 

Bob,

You questioned salvation, albeit it is a given your wording was partly incoherent, but I got the message.

 

It is through us. We are given a chance to choose to be obedient or disobedient. When we choose to follow Christ as mentioned in the verse, Christ will help guide us and teach us the correct path. We are not forced to follow that path. We may put our hand to the plow and we may look back. We must keep the course and we must remain worthy.

 

Bob,

The passage you quote is taken out of context. It is not a Gospel invitation, it is written to the church.

 

Its not taken out of context. You just don't understand it.

 

Bop,

It's been used out of context for so long that many, just as you, believe it is being correctly interpreted and applied.

 

The Revelation passage about Christ standing at the door knocking is not the door of salvation, it is the door of fellowship. He is saying we are to continually confess our sin as believers in order to sup, fellowship with Him. All who overcome by Grace through faith will reign with Him in His Kingdom.

 

Lets hear it.

 

So when He says "If ANY man will hear my voice" He is just talking about believers? LOL I hope your kidding.

 

Bob,

If a person is addressing a church, as Christ is here, and says 'any' it is referring to any of THEM and applicably, according to Revelation 3:20 specifically, it is to any of his church throughout time. Context.

 

Revelation 3:19-20,19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent. Christ rebukes those He loves. If you haven’t been rebuked, haven’t been chastened by Christ you need to check up on your salvation and make sure it is by “Grace through Faith”. Christ rebuked them out of love just as He does for all who have truly received Him as their savior. Christ loved their souls hated their sin but loved their souls. They needed only to comply to His rebuke and chastening of them. Turn from their spiritual blindness and nakedness to see the Salvation gift, Christ has for them. Christ is knocking at the door for them. Christ continues to deal with them in Grace. Those who were saved and in Operational death, they must repent and come to Him and He will sup with them... Christ is knocking on the Heart of believers to return to the truth, return to sound doctrine."

He is definitely speaking to the believers who He chastens for following after false doctrine and for walking out of the Operation of the Holy Spirit. They are the ones we see in Ephesian 5:18, "And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit;"
Those drunk with the sin and with the false doctrines are told to walk not in them but to be filled with the Spirit, those are the ones He is knocking for. For them to come back to the truth and to confess their sin and be controlled by the Spirit, to be Operating under the guidance and direction of the Holy Spirit.

 

LOL, that just plain stupid. You dispensationalist will say anything to get out of obedience. The warnings given to the churches in Revelation are universal warnings to all who will listen.


If it was written to churches then why does Christ say this?

11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.

 

We are born in a condition of disobedience. God makes His people willing in the day of His power...psalm 110.
In 2 Tim 1:9....notice it was grace given to us, not a choice that is going to be rejected.

 

Bob,

I'm no dispy am reformed and also am what others call a lordship salvationist. But that just means I believe in true Gospel conversion. Also you may consider looking at passages as either being descriptive or prescriptive when concerning soteriololgy. That would help in not conflating evidence of salvation with earning salvation.

The context of Rev. 22:11 is speaking to all those who are lost compared to those genuinely converted.

 

Isn't, "the faith," the cause of the bestowal of, "the grace," and therefore was therefore necessary to have preceded, "the grace"?

Wasn't the grace of God which came through,"the faith," brought forth when this verse became fact? Hebrews 5:9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him; Is that not when? Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,

Is not, being made perfect, Heb 5:9 relative to Jesus being, Called of God an high priest after the order of Melchisedec. Verse 10 relative to Verse's 5,6 So also Christ glorified not himself to be made an high priest; but he that said unto him, Thou art my Son, to day have I begotten thee. As he saith also in another place, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.

Therefore grace came when it was stated, Thou art my Son, to day have I begotten thee. which was the day of the resurrection per Acts 13:33?

Did that take place because of, the faith? Did, the faith precede, the grace? Just any old faith or the faith?

I believe, "the faith," that brought, "the grace," of (the) God was the learned Obedience of the Son Heb 5:8 unto death, even the death of the cross Phil 2:8 Wherefore V9 God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: See Heb 1:4,5 Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they. For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?


What about my question concerning Eph 2:8 and Titus 3:5 saying the very same thing in two different ways? Could you touch on that?

 

Exactly what I am trying to show in my post with TCassidy. All consider.
Before the foundation of the world, before the creation, Jesus was going to be the redeemer, Therefore even at that time Jesus was placed as, propitiation. The place of mercy.

Upon what. The Faith, of God in the blood of the Son of God to be born of woman. God believed his Son born of woman would be obedient unto his belief, his faith. Spoken of Jesus born of the virgin Mary: Hebrews 5:7 Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared; --- Jesus was in agony in the garden striving for obedience. Said of that Son, born of woman. Verse 9 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; ----- Jesus became the obedience of faith, the faith of God the Father.

Gal 3. before the coming of the faith
the faith having come no more

 

A. Saved
B, Faith
C. Grace

Is there a chronological order to those three if so what?

 

I asked concerning Eph 2:8 and Titus 3:5. Here is what I think and believe.

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

From Titus 3:5

According to mercy = the faith see post 78
Saved = saved
Grace = regeneration and renewing of Holy Spirit see post 78 Jesus my friends was raised from the dead. If that is not re generated what is? Acts 2:33 having received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit