Featured No one deserved to be saved. Why the angst with Particular redemption?

No one deserved to be saved. Why the angst with Particular redemption?

One reason: It's hated because it takes sovereignty and autonomy away from man. It's hated for the very same reason that Adam hated that he couldn't eat of that tree.

 

How can that be when Jesus clearly told Nicodemus you must be born again and then stated one must believe on the Son to not perish but to have everlasting life. That life is spiritual life which comes by one believing on the Son, the Spiritual Life is regenerated, reborn, becomes everlasting after believing on the Son not before. Regeneration occurs once Faith is expressed not before. Spiritual Life Comes after believing not before. The Holy Spirit doesn't come and indwell until belief has ocurred and that is when Spiritual life is born, regenerated.

 

Not one person deserves to be saved. Yet God (Christ) command to Nicodemus and thus to everyone "Believe on the Son to gain everlasting life." That life is the regenerated Spiritual life that we must have to be right with God so "Believing must come before regeneration."

 

One more time; Do you know the difference between the words 'can' and 'may'?

 

Where did he use those words anywhere in this thread?

 

No one has suggested that he did. This is a strawman

 

You say we were made alive in Christ, then were given the gift of faith, and then were enabled to believe.

But the Bible says we were made alive AFTER we believed.

But these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in His name.
John 20:31

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Let me see you state man has nothing not one thing to do with being born again. Regeneration is=spiritual birth, that would be the Spirit of man being born, and you say God brings it to life before one believes and yet Jesus said to Nicodemus, ye must be Born again, then He emphasized the means further in John 3, first in verse 14 He makes a comparison with the Jews in the wilderness, when the serpent would bite someone and the cure look upon the serpent on the pole. Did Moses go around choosing certain ones to lift their heads and make them look up? No they had to make a conscious choice.

Let's look Numbers 21:
6 "And the Lord sent fiery serpents among the people, and they bit the people; and much people of Israel died.
7 Therefore the people came to Moses, and said, We have sinned, for we have spoken against the Lord, and against thee; pray unto the Lord, that he take away the serpents from us. And Moses prayed for the people.
8 And the Lord said unto Moses, Make thee a fiery serpent, and set it upon a pole: and it shall come to pass, that every one that is bitten, when he looketh upon it, shall live.
9 And Moses made a serpent of brass, and put it upon a pole, and it came to pass, that if a serpent had bitten any man, when he beheld the serpent of brass, he lived."

Jesus shows us the type here, who could live, those who hose to look up at the serpent, right? Any man that is person who was bitten. The offer was to all who were bitten, all of the Human race who are bitten by sin and dead in trespasses and sins, can call upon the Lord, right? Everyone ever born except for the one who was hung upon the tree He is the one we look too. If they chose to look upon the one who hung upon the tree what would occur for those bitten? They would live. Same with salvation, Jesus was to be hung upon the Tree that is the cross of Calvary. Whoever chooses to believe that is look to the one who hung upon the tree, will have life eternal. That is they will have their Spiritual life born for all eternity, this shows first one must make a choice and two once that choice is made it is for all eternity, it can't be lost. If verse 15 weren't enough Jesus made it even more clear in verse 16 of John 3, whosoever that is anyone who chooses to believe will not perish but have life eternal. Then He reiterated it yet again in verse 18 of John 3

"He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God."

He that believeth is not condemned that is whoever looks up to the one on the cross by choosing to look up, they are not condemned, but those who will not look upon the one on the cross are condemned already. In Numbers we are not told if any choose not to look, but if they chose not to they were going to die, in fact they were condemned to die the moment they were bitten and unless they looked upon the one hanging on the pole, they would perish. Again these are Jesus' words not mine, "whosoever believeth," Those "who believe" He places squarely on the individual to make the choice to believe. Jesus says it clearly those who believe have eternal life.

If you see different then show where in these verses He regenerates them that is gives them life eternal before they believe, for regeneration is New spiritual Life which comes and regenerates them. Jesus says it comes by believing. So too did Paul and Silas.

 

,It is not a time line. It speaks of the results of believing and the means. ...the written word of God.

 

A plain reading of the scripture shows an IF-THEN statement. If you believe, then you have life.

It's plain as day. I don't know how you can deny it.

No matter how you try to read this verse it does not say you are made alive, then you believe.

 

I agree it is salvation that is the gift of God. And that it comes by grace. And the grace, came, through faith. BTW I believe the tense of came to be correct.

For by grace are ye saved through (τῆς the) faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: The very same faith spoken of in Gal 3:23 and 25 and spoken of as before, the faith, came and after, the faith came. Faith that is relative to being justified, that is being made righteous. V 24.

What is, the faith, that brings the righteousness of God?

Romans 5:19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous. The faith in Eph 2:8 by which we are made righteous of Gal 3:25 is relative to the obedience of one of Rom 5:19 The obedience of faith. Jesus conceived by the Holy Spirit, brought forth of the virgin Mary, became the obedience of faith. Hebrews 5:8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; Even being the very Son of the living God, Jesus learned (τὴν the) obedience. Phil 3:8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross. After learning the obedience through sufferings he became obedient unto death even the death of the cross.

That is obedience of faith. Whose faith? Who believed the Son born of woman would be obedient unto the giving of his life, of the flesh, which is in the blood, unto death even the death of the cross for redemption?

Phil 2:9 διόdió, dee-o'; from G1223 and G3739; through which thing, i.e. consequently:—for which cause, therefore, wherefore.

The Son of God, Jesus was dead but because of, the obedience, to the faith of God; God by the Spirit quickened that which in the flesh had given his life a ransom for many. The grace of God. The grace of God is the grace of life. Eternal life, of which we presently are heirs thereof, not yet inheritors. Titus 3:7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

Declared righteous by grace to the one, who had been obedient unto death. By the obedience of one shall many be made righteous. Rom 5:19

Faith does not come from man. JMHO sorry for the rant.

 

It's amazing and remarkable that so many cannot see the implications that are so plain to see. They need a 'word for word' statement. It's tragic when this lack of insight is also apparent in exegeting Scripture.

 

Well, we better hurry up and believe 'both' of them just in case there may be a drop of Jewish blood in our veins. Would hate to miss out on eternal life due to a technical error.