Featured Order of Salvation

Read earlier in the thread man.

Just the measenger here

 

In order to believe what one does not already believe, one must first change one's mind or view. Those Greek words are commonly and yes badly translated as repent or repentance. John in his gospel account does not cite Jesus where He was using those terms.

 

Once again we see Calvinist claiming the "measure of faith" refers to our faith in Christ. Hogwash. The "measure of faith" refers to our area of ministry within the faith (the ministry of Christ.)

 

If He has given it to all then all would believe

 

Van
That makes absolutely no sense

 

To which argument?
You are referring mostly to later in the thread which I had not yet replied to.

Typically the word of God teaches faith precedes salvation. That is the issue. Nowhere in the word of God does salvation precede faith.

 

Nothing makes sense to those feigning blindness.

Once again we see Calvinist claiming the "measure of faith" refers to our faith in Christ. Hogwash. The "measure of faith" refers to our area of ministry within the faith (the ministry of Christ.) Romans 12:3-8

 

Another great verse is this one .
2That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.
13¶In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
eph 1 .

 

Did God limit the amount of people who were saved by looking at the bronze serpent in the wilderness ? This is the example Jesus uses for John 3.16 after all . Or did whosever looked at the Serpent lived ?

 

John 12:33, ". . . This he said, signifying what death he should die."

 

Do people have faith in doctors , pilots , chairs, dentists, wifes and husbands ?

 

"Faith" is such a big and complicated word. Do we have "faith"? When did it start? How much do we have? How much is enough faith? Can I loose it? Does God give it? Is it really my faith?

"Repent" is easier to understand. We can all remember being on our knees and seeking forgiveness from God. Those moments are burned into our memory like an Ebeneezer [stone of remembrance to mark an important event].

Funny how much we want to know if Faith came before Repentance or after ... as if it would change anything.

Let's talk about "SOMETHING". We will not call it "faith", because it might or might not be "faith" ... but it is "SOMETHING". This SOMETHING comes before we do anything. While Jesus was alive, the Father DREW disciples to Jesus and GAVE 'His sheep' to Jesus. Jesus Himself CHOSE His Apostles to come and follow Him. After the Crucifixion, Jesus says that He will DRAW all men to Himself. (I do not want to debate "everyone without exception" vs "some from every nation" in this topic.) So before or after the Crucifixion, there is a DRAW by God that must logically come before any act on our part. This DRAW is that "SOMETHING" that I want to point out.

We see this SOMETHING at work in Acts.
In Acts 2 we see God DRAW a crowd and begin to do SOMETHING to some of them and not to others ...

• 12 And they all continued in amazement and great perplexity, saying to one another, “What does this mean?” 13 But others were mocking and saying, “They are full of sweet wine.”

After this, we see Peter deliver the words from God under the anointing of the Holy Spirit (sorry if my Pentecostal roots are showing) ...

• 14 But Peter, taking his stand with the eleven, raised his voice and declared to them:

There can be little doubt to any Christian that the Word of God has power. As Scripture says, God's words do not return void but accomplish their purpose (as an aside, I was always impressed how the same word makes a ready heart more ready and a hard heart even harder). Even here, God seems to have done SOMETHING in their heart during the hearing and before any action on their part. I personally believe that this is the work of the Holy Spirit; to do SOMETHING to DRAW us to Christ ...

• 37 Now when they heard this, they were pierced to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, “Brethren, what shall we do?”

Only after God has done His SOMETHING, do we see Peter commanding the people what they must do ...

• 38 Peter said to them, “Repent, and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39 For the promise is for you and your children and for all who are far off, as many as the Lord our God will call to Himself.”

In Acts 16, SOMETHING happened in the heart of Lydia and in the heart of the Jailer ...

• 14 A woman named Lydia, from the city of Thyatira, a seller of purple fabrics, a worshiper of God, was listening; and the Lord opened her heart to respond to the things spoken by Paul. 15 And when she and her household had been baptized, she urged us, saying, "If you have judged me to be faithful to the Lord, come into my house and stay." And she prevailed upon us.
  
• 29 And he called for lights and rushed in, and trembling with fear he fell down before Paul and Silas, 30 and after he brought them out, he said, "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?" 31 They said, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household." 32 And they spoke the word of the Lord to him together with all who were in his house.

What then is the role of this often seen (and personally experienced) SOMETHING that seems to precede the call for us to do anything?

 

Not literally everyone but people from all nations and tribes and to

I believe that man is at the mercy of God. Meaning- until God does something, man can do nothing

 

Did you believe the Gospel? or did

Regeneration preceding faith has to be one of the most radical concepts ever to come out of christianity.

 

But only those with the Holy Spirit can hear God's word. The flesh cannot grasp it in truth.

 

God sent his Son ,what more do you want ?