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If Calvinism is true, then Christ died for God's sins

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Reformed1689

Reformed1689

Well-Known Member
Silverhair said:
What evidence have you put forward that would show that it did not start with Augustine? A calvinist book, what would expect it to say?

Your reasoning is circular read a calvinist book to prove that calvinism is true.
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No, that isn't what I said at all. I put forth a book, about history. It is a history book. And yes, it shows the doctrines of grace did not start with Augustine. If you weren't so stubborn and asinine you would check out the evidence and argue based on the evidence rather than just dismissing it.
 
Reformed1689

Reformed1689

Well-Known Member
Silverhair said:
NO. But you will keep bring this up whenever you are in a hole and you know it. I notice that you do not deal with Act 17:27, why is that?
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No? Hmm, then your argument from earlier is bunk. You said we limit the sovereignty of God because we say there is something He cannot do, yet you did just that just now. Why is it different if you do it?
 
Silverhair

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
Reformed1689 said:
He can't. He would rather keep bearing false witness because he know he won't get reprimanded for it.
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Your strawman comments are the stock and trade of those that are in denial of the truth of the bible. You really do not like it when someone disagrees with your calvinism. You have convinced yourself that it is true and will fight to the end to support that errant view.
 
Reformed1689

Reformed1689

Well-Known Member
Silverhair said:
Your strawman comments are the stock and trade of those that are in denial of the truth of the bible. You really do not like it when someone disagrees with your calvinism. You have convinced yourself that it is true and will fight to the end to support that errant view.
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No I don't like it when someone keeps stating falsehoods about me.
 
Silverhair

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
Reformed1689 said:
No, the only one who has ignored text, as well as context, between the three of us is you sir.
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You keep saying that but I am not the calvinist here so that means that I trust what the bible text says but you tend to read into to what you want to find.
 
Silverhair

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
Reformed1689 said:
First of all, does it say can? No, you read that into the text. You are an eisegesis king. It says they should. It does not say they can or will. It says should. Man has an obligation to seek God. Yet we are not far from him. We see him all around us in creation. See Romans 1.

So yes, you ignore the contexts of Scripture to prop up your ridiculous notions.
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You really have a problem with English I see. "so that they should seek the Lord, in the hope that they might grope for Him and find Him"
So your going to deny that these words of Paul a indicating that people can actually do what the words say they can, seek, hope, grope for Him, find Him.

You really do not want the truth of scripture do you.
 
Reformed1689

Reformed1689

Well-Known Member
Silverhair said:
You really have a problem with English I see. "so that they should seek the Lord, in the hope that they might grope for Him and find Him"
So your going to deny that these words of Paul a indicating that people can actually do what the words say they can, seek, hope, grope for Him, find Him.

You really do not want the truth of scripture do you.
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Nobody seeks God. Why do you deny THAT truth?
 
Silverhair

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
Reformed1689 said:
No, that isn't what I said at all. I put forth a book, about history. It is a history book. And yes, it shows the doctrines of grace did not start with Augustine. If you weren't so stubborn and asinine you would check out the evidence and argue based on the evidence rather than just dismissing it.
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Now your just showing that your position is faulty. You do not have to use the language that you have. Would you be surprised if there were books out there that show Augustine was the start of the calvinist philosophy?

Would it surprise you that Augustine held to free will.

"He [God] has revealed to us, through His Holy Scriptures, that there is in man a free choice of will," and that "God's precepts themselves would be of no use to a man unless he had free choice of will, so that by performing them he might obtain the promised rewards." (On Grace and Free Will, chap. II) Augustine (see especially chapters II-IV)
 
Reformed1689

Reformed1689

Well-Known Member
Silverhair said:
Now your just showing that your position is faulty. You do not have to use the language that you have. Would you be surprised if there were books out there that show Augustine was the start of the calvinist philosophy?

Would it surprise you that Augustine held to free will.

"He [God] has revealed to us, through His Holy Scriptures, that there is in man a free choice of will," and that "God's precepts themselves would be of no use to a man unless he had free choice of will, so that by performing them he might obtain the promised rewards." (On Grace and Free Will, chap. II) Augustine (see especially chapters II-IV)
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I know there are books that put forth the false claim that it started with Augustine. But that is all it is, a false claim. And there is nothing wrong with the language I used. Look it up in a dictionary. And again, out of context quotes mean nothing. Are you and @SavedByGrace the same person?
 
Silverhair

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
Reformed1689 said:
No? Hmm, then your argument from earlier is bunk. You said we limit the sovereignty of God because we say there is something He cannot do, yet you did just that just now. Why is it different if you do it?
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How do I limit the sovereignty of God. Your view of the sovereignty of God is defective, you limit His sovereignty then claim your right. The fact you can not understand or accept that God is truly sovereign is the root of your lack of understanding of scripture.
 
Reformed1689

Reformed1689

Well-Known Member
Silverhair said:
How do I limit the sovereignty of God. Your view of the sovereignty of God is defective, you limit His sovereignty then claim your right. The fact you can not understand or accept that God is truly sovereign is the root of your lack of understanding of scripture.
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HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! So you say that by saying God cannot or will not do something it somehow limits his sovereignty. So I ask you if God can sin. You say no, but somehow that doesn't limit his sovereignty? Foolish boy.
 
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