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I would agree with that conclusion. It would be "like" or "in his image" but certainly not 'uncreated.' So, we could conclusive say God can't create an uncreated thing...but can we conclude that God can't create a responsible person? ('responsible' meaning "able to respond" in an real...

Once again, you are incorrect. Can you provide the quote where I have said that? You can't, because I haven't said it. I've said that God has created a creature that can make choices. A free will agent is not NOTHING. A WILL is not 'nothing.' Is God's will 'nothing'? It must be if what...

In another discussion a poster is attempting to argue that it would be impossible for God to create contra-causally free creatures, because that is a quality unique only to God. I have accused him of having a weak view of God because he is claiming God is unable to create someone who is free...

Yes. That is exactly what it does. In fact, press him to define the word 'responsibility' and you will quickly find that mankind, in his worldview, is not even close to being response-able. In fact, quite the opposite, they are unable to respond, yet still held responsible for their...

A sin is breaking a command of HIS...a rule of his. You are attempting to equate God's unwillingness to break his own rules with what you presume is His inability to create responsible creatures... (oh, and remember when I say responsible I actually mean responsible, not "held responsible for...

And MY POINT IS that, saying He can't (or better stated, "WON'T") break his own rules is not equal to saying he CAN'T create a contra-causally free creature. For one, sin has to do with God's holiness, what part of God's nature would preclude his ability to create contra-causally free...

What does that have to do with God's ability to break his own rules as it relates to his ability to create people who have the freedom to break or not break his rules?

We found a point we agree upon! Whoohooo! :thumbsup:

I respectfully disagree. Did the EXTERNAL experience of spending three days in the belly of a fish change the INTERNAL will of Jonah? External means affect how we think and feel about many things. Faith comes by hearing, according to Paul. Hearing the gospel is an external means, but it can...

That's beside the point, as Jesus actually references the twelve in the very passage we are discussing proving my point that he is addressing the ACTUAL context of those being granted to COME TO HIM while here in the flesh, in light of the rest who are being hardened/blinded from seeing Him as...

Agreed. Agreed! (it does not equal effectually made to be willing to believe and repent) God uses human means throughout scripture, so just because a person is used to teach something doesn't mean God doesn't get the credit, and just because God is said to have done the teaching doesn't mean he...

Actually is would deny anyone living past the cross could come to Christ in the flesh like the 12 did, who were specifically referenced in John 6, " 65 He went on to say, "This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless the Father has enabled him." 66 From this time many of his...

I like this guy...sounds like a summary of what I've been arguing about the biblical doctrine of judicial hardening for years on this forum. :thumbsup:

I believe men are responsible for God's revelation even after the fall. There is no reason not to believe so since God does hold man responsible. By the way, I understand responsible to mean as it suggests...response-able (able to respond), not 'held to account for something you have no...

You are attempting to equate God's presumed inability to create morally free agents (contra-causally free rather than determined) with God's choice to not to break his own rules? Do you think that is reasonable? Logical? To PRESUME that on the basis of God's Holy sinlessness, that He must be...

That is not what Paul spells out regarding the mystery of the gospel. Just like the concept of 'God's PRESENT RACIAL SPHERE of redemptive activity' is not something that is ever actually taught in the scriptures. Those are concepts you bring to the table in order to justify your particular...

John 17 contains your answer: At the beginning of Jesus' prayer he speaks of the apostles being 'given to him by the father' and later he prays also for those who will believe in Him through their message. This shows that God's purpose in giving this remnant from Israel to Christ was so that...

I agree that there is only one way for anyone to be saved. I agree there is only one gospel. But, just as Paul CLEARLY said and I JUST quoted, there is a mystery that just now being revealed. You have yet to really address the concept of Israel being cut off the vine and the Gentiles being...

Oh, enough said. I understand. I honestly couldn't figure out what you were disregarding about that quote. Now I know what you were meaning. Thanks for clarifying. One thing at a time brother. No need to jump to conclusions. I will gladly address each point in time. I simply needed to...

So God can only do what Luke can fathom. Ok, got it.