Can The Case Be Made That Christ Died For All?

[AustinC]

Without Christ having.bought the whole of all mankind paying for their sins. The lost cannot know Christ died for them before they believe.

Correct. They cannot know. And, they don't care to know. They outright think it's crazy.

 

[37818]

This is your definition of general redemption?
I am not following your thought.
Are you saying that there is a one time chance to hear God's sales pitch and if you don't jump on the invitation the first time around, then it is impossible to choose afterwards?
Again, I am not following your thought here.

I do not understand your argument here.

 

[37818]

Correct. They cannot know. And, they don't care to know. They outright think it's crazy.

Without the claim Christ died for them there is no basis to believe in Christ.

 

[AustinC]

1Jn 2:2 And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world.

Rom 3:21 But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets,
Rom 3:22 even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe. For there is no difference;
Rom 3:23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,
Rom 3:24 being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus,
Rom 3:25 whom God set forth as a propitiation by His blood, through faith, to demonstrate His righteousness, because in His forbearance God had passed over the sins that were previously committed,
Rom 3:26 to demonstrate at the present time His righteousness, that He might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.

1 John 2:2 has been addressed many, many times. You isolate a sentence and thus you fail to grasp what John is saying in the whole of his letter. Your hermeneutics are bad. We have shown you this. You are showing us your ignorance.

Romans 3 is such a wonderful treatise on justification by faith alone for the believer. Salvation has already taken place by God's grace and justification is next in line. Thanks for reminding all believers about what God has done for them in giving them the gift of faith.

 

[Reformed1689]

And there is no Scripture that actually teaches that.

What Bible are you reading? Are you saying that Jesus did not die for those that would believe in Him? Man you are on some shaky ground here.

 

[Reformed1689]

This questions leaves me without understanding

You wondered what payment still being required I was referring to. So since you obviously do not know what payment we are talking about, I was confirming you do, in fact, adhere to PSA?

 

[AustinC]

Without the claim Christ died for them there is no basis to believe in Christ.

They cannot believe unless God makes them alive to the gospel. When God calls their name, they will believe and have faith.

We say "believe in the Lord Jesus Christ" and many/most look at us as fools. Those whom God calls out, look at us and say, "I believe" precisely because God just made them alive and gave them faith to believe.
It is a profound mystery how the Holy Spirit does this, but it is a glorious mystery. When you hear Jesus call you, you know it's the voice of your Shepherd.

 

[Campion]

 

[Reformed1689]

This is just stupid. It's not Calvin we get this from, it's Scripture.

 

[Silverhair]

I do not understand argument here.

This goes back to a post that reformed 1689 has not dealt with and I doubt that he will.

 

[Silverhair]

I do understand the context, but Acts 13:48 makes the point that only those appointed unto eternal life believed. Not every Gentile believed, but only those who were appointed unto eternal life.

So you deny Eph 1:13 & Rom 10:13.

 

[Silverhair]

Wonderful verse, it's in my Bible too. What I notice it does not say is this:

And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for every man and woman that has ever walked the earth.

Yep, doesn't say that, so the burden would be on you to make it say that.

So "whole world" means what to you?

 

[Silverhair]

No what you do not veil is that you are a humanist.

So of your comments are really childish but I am starting to expect that from some of the people on here. Call me what ever makes you happy.

 

[Silverhair]

Believe me, I did. You do not argue against the DoG, rather, you argue against a fantastical version of it made up by yourself and not what is actually believed or argued.

I just posted what you DoG states. Yet you deny it so I have to wonder if you really know what you believe.

 

[Silverhair]

Even if that were true, that still doesn't solve the problem of the debt payment being required twice for those who do not believe.

Then you do not know your scripture. Stop looking at scripture threw those calvinist glasses.

 

[Silverhair]

Asking other Calvies here, do any of you believe that we are saved before conversion?

Can we all say confirmation basis.

 

[AustinC]

Seven straight wiffs. Silverhair is going for a double strikeout.

 

[Silverhair]

I don't tell ANYONE Christ died for their sin, because I do not know that to be true. I tell them Christ died for those who would believe in him.

And that shows a major flaw in calvinism. You can not even know if you are saved as you had nothing to do with being saved. You did not even believe, God had to give you faith and you just have to hope that it was real. It could all be just wishful thinking on your part.

It would be interesting to hear you explain the gospel to your loved ones. Do you tell them that odds are that God did not pick them out and that they are bound for hell and there is nothing they can do about it.

How do you explain Joh 3:14-18 or Eph 1:13 or Rom 10:13?

 

[Silverhair]

No.
God calls us from death to new life and in so doing, saves us by his gracious act.
We immediately respond in action of repentance and faith to believe.

So your saying that you are saved by God before you actually believe in God. But I was told that no calvinist believes that, so does that mean your not a calvinist?

 

[Silverhair]

Seven straight wiffs. Silverhair is going for a double strikeout.

But I notice none of you are bothering to try and refute what I have posted.