Can the unsaved to good works?

God chooses all for it is not His will that any would perish. It is man that rejects Him and man's sin separates him from God.

If as you say that "believing" is works then the works of believing is accepted of the Lord, as a matter of Scripture, it is required of the Lord, and there are different kind of works as in the following Scriptures.
The first works spoken of by Paul is "believe on the Lord Jesus Christ" and thou shalt be saved.
The second works is also spoken of by Paul also and says we are not saved by works but goes on to tell what kind of works and it is the works of the Law Covenant as is plainly shown in Eph:2
So, the conclusion of the matter is that the works of the Law cannot save you but you indeed must have the works of believing to be saved. Believing does not save you but is a commandment of God of us before He will save us. That is not my saying but the word of the Holy Scriptures of God.


(works of believing in the Lord Jesus Christ)
Acts, chapter 16
"27": And the keeper of the prison awaking out of his sleep, and seeing the prison doors open, he drew out his sword, and would have killed himself, supposing that the prisoners had been fled.

"28": But Paul cried with a loud voice, saying, Do thyself no harm: for we are all here.

"29": Then he called for a light, and sprang in, and came trembling, and fell down before Paul and Silas,

"30": And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?

"31": And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

(works of the Law Covenant)
Ephesians, chapter 2
8: For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9: Not of works, lest any man should boast.
10: For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
11: Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
12: That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
13: But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
14: For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
15: Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

 

Is it, inversely, also man's righteousness that brings him to God? If so, then we certainly have much about which to brag. Do you believe that we were naturally more righteous than those who rejected Christ because we accepted him? Or is it because of grace that we accepted Christ and were justified?

Joseph Botwinick

 

It is because of grace that we can choose to put our faith in the finished work of Christ and be saved. Of course that is nothing for us to brag about. Just because I chose to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ doesn't mean I saved myself. He did the work, He offered the gift, accepting it was no work at all.

 

I and Calvin agree with you, my friend.

Let me summarize what you just said:

1. Were it not for the grace of God, we would be completely unable to choose Christ.
2. Not everyone recieves that grace, otherwise, everyone would recieve Christ.:thumbs:

Joseph Botwinick

 

This is said about your viewpoint, too. Man...being unable to choose God...refuses to be saved. God would be powerless to save them, too, or if He is not powerless, has created them for the sole purpose of destruction.

 

Titus, chapter 2
"11": For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,

"12": Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;

"13": Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;

"14": Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

The problem with your belief is you apply it only to the pre-chosen when in fact it is to all men if they will believe.

 

God chooses all for it is not His will that any would perish. It is man that rejects Him and man's sin separates him from God.

If as you say that "believing" is works then the works of believing is accepted of the Lord, as a matter of Scripture, it is required of the Lord, and there are different kind of works as in the following Scriptures.
The first works spoken of by Paul is "believe on the Lord Jesus Christ" and thou shalt be saved.
The second works is also spoken of by Paul also and says we are not saved by works but goes on to tell what kind of works and it is the works of the Law Covenant as is plainly shown in Eph:2
So, the conclusion of the matter is that the works of the Law cannot save you but you indeed must have the works of believing to be saved. Believing does not save you but is a commandment of God of us before He will save us. That is not my saying but the word of the Holy Scriptures of God.


(works of believing in the Lord Jesus Christ)
Acts, chapter 16
"27": And the keeper of the prison awaking out of his sleep, and seeing the prison doors open, he drew out his sword, and would have killed himself, supposing that the prisoners had been fled.

"28": But Paul cried with a loud voice, saying, Do thyself no harm: for we are all here.

"29": Then he called for a light, and sprang in, and came trembling, and fell down before Paul and Silas,

"30": And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?

"31": And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

(works of the Law Covenant)
Ephesians, chapter 2
8: For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9: Not of works, lest any man should boast.
10: For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
11: Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
12: That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
13: But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
14: For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
15: Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
__________________

Jesus Himself says you must have the works of "believing" or you will be lost.

 

Bob,

Do you believe that everyone recieves an equal amount of grace from God? If that is true, then why do some accept that grace and others reject it? Is the grace of God not equally effective for all?

Joseph Botwinick

 

Not everyone recieves grace, this is true, but it is offered to everyone.

 

Wow!!! If we are right, (and I believe we are), I can't wait to see you explain that one to God.

 

Does everyone recieve an equal offering of grace? If this is true, then why do some not accept it? Is the grace of God of no effect for some? Is it because they were not as righteous in their lost state as others are?

Joseph Botwinick

 

Grace, (Unmerited favor), is equally offered to all men.

 

Do you believe that God is helpless?

I'd like to see you explain that one to God.

Joseph Botwinick

 

Of course I don't believe that everyone receives the same amount of Grace. If that were so then no one would be lost. I do believe that by God's Grace everyone that has ever been born has received the knowledge that he is lost when he comes to an age to know to do good and does it not.

"Ge ye not from house to house saying, know ye the Lord, for they shall know me from the least unto the greatest."

Why do some not accept it? It is because man is not a rock or tree stump but God gave him a mind to choose good or evil as He gave Adam and men love darkness rather than light and neither doth they come to the light lest their deeds be reproved.

I ask you, Do you believe Adam had a choice?

 

Is God's grace not equally effective and sufficient for all men?

Joseph Botwinick

 

Ok. So now I see where you and Blammo disagree with each other, as he believes God offers everyone an equal amount of grace.

Now Bob,

If everyone does not recieve the same amount of grace, is that because God, in his sovereign will, chose to offer more grace to some and less to others?

Joseph Botwinick

 

Some do not accept it because they are full of pride, "I'm a good person, I can do it myself, I don't need any help.", While those who do accept it realize they are lost, on there way to hell, helpless, and in need of a Saviour.

Your doctrine says that, these who are lost and on their way to hell, are in that state, and remain in that state, by the will of God. But, our side says that God made a way for every man to be saved. If anyone goes to hell, it won't be God's fault, it will be their's.

 

Those that do what God commanded and that is to believe then they receive the Grace of Salvation and not just the teaching Grace.

Acts, chapter 16
"30": And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?

"31": And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

 

Very cute, nice try. I said grace is equally offered to every man.

Is unmerited favor something that can be given out is doses? Unmerited favor is unmerited favor, no?