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Did Christ Atone for ALL humans?
- Thread starter Robert William
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If you say yes, then nobody will end up in Hell, because those who's sins have been atoned can't end up in Hell, if you say no, then there is no sacrifice and everybody ends up in Hell.
Condition before answering: First state yes or no, then give an answer, thanks.
No. Only the elect.
Who are the Elect and why were they chosen?
ALL of those of us who were lost as sinners, and that God freely chose to redeem us by the Cross of Jesus...
elected based upon his selection and free will choosing alone, not based upon foreknowledge or my free will choosing of Jesus first!
Howdy :wavey:
So do you believe Yeshua atoned for all humans?
Could you please give me your understanding of the Atonement, thanks.
Howdy :wavey:
So do you believe Yeshua atoned for all humans?
Could you please give me your understanding of the Atonement, thanks.
His death upon the Cross was sufficient to have saved/atoned for all sinners, but God intended to save by that act just His own Elect!
Limited atonement as to what the scope of just whom it was to get applied towards in the end...
Could you please give us your understanding of the Atonement, what does it do or what has it accomplished??
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What?
Is 1 Peter 1:1-2 missing in your translation?!
I will quote a snip from that passage:
"To God's elect...who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father..."
To say our election is not based on foreknowledge is denying plain Scripture.
Who is "us"?
Foreknowledge due to him knowing that he caused us to become the Elect as the basis of Him knowing this factually, NOT that he is basing knowing this upon seeing us freely choosing to accept Jesus first!
Totally agree with Apostle peter here, but not with the meaning of the term Foreklnowledge that those against Calvinism vest in the term!
Just stating that election came from God to us due to him willing that to be, not due to him affecting it to happen AFTER seeing that we would choose to accept jesus or not by "free will"
Election is due to him first choosing us, not us first choosing him!
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Yes, he is a devout Muslim; yes he can be an iman.
Why can't they be the same.
I think you don't know much about Islam. Do you think every Muslim is behind a bush ready to cut off your head? an extremist with an agenda? Then you know nothing about this religion or its people.
Let the scriptures speak!
Romans 8:28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.
29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
31 What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?
32 He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?
33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.
34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?
36 As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
37 Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.
38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
According to scripture the atonement of Christ was effectual and I say according to scripture a surety. We love him because he first loved us. Notice the He in the election process... He did I ALL which bears the question... If Christ did it ALL how can he lose any that God gave him?... Brother Glen
The scriptures say nothing about being "predestined to salvation," nor does it say anything about being "reprobated to Hell." These are inventions of Augustine and Calvin.
We are predestinated to be conformed to the image of his son.
That is not salvation.
Amen:thumbsup: But can free willies say that without a free will choice??
What makes you think that man didn't have a free choice. Nothing has been posted that says he didn't. The mere posting of Scripture doesn't deny any doctrine.
BTW, did you "freely choose" to type that post, or did the Holy Spirit force you to do it?
Why in the world are you bringing that junk up? I have said nothing of the sort. You make up hypotheticals and then attribute them to me so you have the satisfaction of concluding :"Well, you know nothing about Islam." That is your usual method of operation.
Now answer my question. I said that a devout Muslim would not consider the Bible, especially the New Testament as being sacred. Do you actually want to affirm that they do think the N.T. is sacred?
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You had said in post 244 that election is not based on forknowledge. You flatly denied Scripture at that point. According to 1 Peter 1:1,2 it is indeed based on God's foreknowledge.
Who cares if others invest the word with a different meaning? Stick with Scripture --don't run from it.
And please stop spinning.
Yes and no.
If you hand them the Bible they would treat it with far more respect than any Christian I know. They would never set it on the floor. They would keep it clean, never set it beside anything that is dirty or allow it become dusty or dirty. In some sense then there is respect for the written word, the Bible.
They would show more respect while it is being read--keeping their children quiet and listening themselves.
In their actual beliefs they believe that the Bible as we have it today has been changed and that the Christian Scriptures in its truest form are found in the Koran. That doesn't mean that they give our Bible any disrespect, however.
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