Iranian assassination ill-advised

[asterisktom]

sooner or later we as a nation must achieve solidarity if we expect to win WWIII.

I believe we are fortunate/blessed to have Trump as Commander In Chief - we have a chance of winning (Deo Volente).

Deo? Do you mean the Deo of Luke 9:55?

 

[Wingman68]

I have read again carefully all of the responses on this thread, the thoughtful ones at least. I noticed that not one of you mentioned the event that largely created the monstrous Iran of today.

It was not 9/11.
It was not the Carter years hostage crisis and over through by the Mullahs.

It goes back to 1953. The Iranians had a democratic election. Just the kind we profess we want for all countries to have. They chose Prime Minister Mohammad Mosaddegh. But we (the US and Great Britain) ousted him in order to reinstate a puppet, Mohammad Reza Shah Pahlavi, for the sake of keeping control of their own oil. (How dare the Iranians insist on rights to their own oil!)

Here is a little quote from Wiki on that ugly incident:

"According to the CIA's declassified documents and records, some of the most feared mobsters in Tehran were hired by the CIA to stage pro-Shah riots on 19 August.[24] Other CIA-paid men were brought into Tehran in buses and trucks, and took over the streets of the city.[25] Between 200[3] and 300[4] people were killed because of the conflict. Mosaddegh was arrested, tried and convicted of treason by the Shah's military court"

So the animosity of Iranians to us is not from Islamic fanaticism - at least not historically. It is from our stealing their democracy from them. This animosity enabled the destabilization that led to the Mullahs coming into power. And it has largely fueled the Iran of today's attitude towards us.

If Iran is a monster today it is a Frankenstein of our own making.

The fact that no one here even mentioned this important antecedent is very telling.

You keep reiterating about rereading the thoughtful posts. You don’t warrant thoughtful in my opinion, it’s a waste of time. You are consistently left of center, & always trying to throw out strawmen to justify yourself, & if that doesn’t sway the masses, you pull out the Bible. When you are able to justify the planks of the left in this Baptist board, perhaps I too would take the time to attempt a ‘thoughtful’ discussion. Foreign policy is your gig but it takes a backseat to the other planks of the left in my mind. I never see lefties here engage in that discussion, so......so sorry if you think I’m not thoughtful enough to reread. Cheers.

 

[HankD]

Deo? Do you mean the Deo of Luke 9:55?

That was then, this is now...

 

[HankD]

Deo? Do you mean the Deo of Luke 9:55?

bro, in war, neither side has a majority on righteousness, I know that...

but the blood of 60 million innocents cries out for vengeance ...

 

[asterisktom]

You are consistently left of center, & always trying to throw out strawmen to justify yourself, & if that doesn’t sway the masses, you pull out the Bible.

No, I am not under illusions that I am swaying the masses. I don't really care.
I am speaking my mind. I don't care what others say. Well, I do if they present reasonable, Scripturally based responses. But these issues are not up for vote. And the Bible is, and always has been, my starting point and foundation.

It is not something I just pull out. I have been waiting from response #1 to see someone tying the issue now with the timeless Bible which, Paul tells us in Timothy is profitable for all issues. Or did I miss something?

 

[asterisktom]

That was then, this is now...

You have the adverbs reversed. Jesus was speaking of the Now. The New Covenant. The misguided disciples were still stuck in the Then of the Old Covenant.

We are still in the Now of the New Covenant.

 

[asterisktom]

bro, in war, neither side has a majority on righteousness, I know that...

but the blood of 60 million innocents cries out for vengeance ...

Rom. 12:19 Beloved, do not avenge yourselves, but rather give place to wrath; for it is written, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” says the Lord."

And who are the 60 million?

 

[HankD]

You have the adverbs reversed. Jesus was speaking of the Now. The New Covenant. The misguided disciples were still stuck in the Then of the Old Covenant.

We are still in the Now of the New Covenant.

No, this is in the futurist book of Revelation suddenly become the present tense TODAY.

 

[HankD]

Rom. 12:19 Beloved, do not avenge yourselves, but rather give place to wrath; for it is written, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” says the Lord."

And who are the 60 million?

Ripped from the womb, poisoned in the womb, ground up in the womb, strangled outside the womb...

This blood cries out for vengeance, the whole world watched and slumbered and slept...

until a certain POTUS showed up.

 

[Revmitchell]

What facts? All I read were Fox News talking points.

Pathetic

 

[Rob_BW]

Oh come on. You probably also go to Wiki for certain facts. Don't play the scholar card on this informal discussion. Wiki is basically trustworthy on providing basic facts. It is in the interpretation that they are often shaky. Which of those facts from that snippet do you contest? You can go to the WIki yourself and check the links (One, I think, is broken). On these points I mentioned there is plenty of redundancy of sources.

Your first sentence is most likely true. Your second is not so much. Does not a sovereign nation have an inherent right over its own resources - regardless of their ideology? And how do you know that they want "all oil reserves in Asia"?


And Israel is dedicated to the destruction of Iran. Why don't we leave the two to settle their differences by war or wisdom (not likely). Why are we all so bound to Israel? It is our faulty theology that does not recognize the true nature of this faux "people of God".


No, it does matter how Iran got this way. A key to defusing this situation certainly must be understanding their national baggage. We need to learn from history.


The Eisenhower administration are the ones that gave them weapons grade uranium in the mid 50's. Are we to fault them for the possession and improvement of that gift, seeing that their country is ringed with US enemy bases? How would we feel if, say Russia or China had their bases in southern Canada or northern Mexico?


How do you know this? And how do you facilely speak of the whole nation is a homogenous Borglike entity?

And, no, I am not a fan of what Iran has become. But I separate the people of Iran - some of whom I met - from those who currently hold it hostage.

A challenge: Can anyone justify that attitudes displayed in this thread from a Biblical standpoint? From the New Testament?

After all, this is a Biblical discussion board.

Romans 3. Paul wrote under Roman hegemony, a superpower who managed client states ver a wide range.

 

[asterisktom]

The area the state department wanted Americans citizens to leave was Baghdad and the immediate surrounding area. They had intel that Soleimani had attacks planned on US citizens in this area.

The area that will be safer now that Soleimani is dead is the entire middle east. These two "areas" are not the same, so no, I don't see the contradiction.

I tend to agree with the assessment in this link:
Ex-Trump official calls BS on Pompeo’s claim that Suleimani killing makes the world ‘safer’

 

[asterisktom]

No, this is in the futurist book of Revelation suddenly become the present tense TODAY.

Another example showing the dangers of misreading Revelation as a futurist. Christ's Kingdom will never be superseded. Neither will His precepts. What you are arguing for is a return to the Old Testament.

 

[asterisktom]

Romans 3. Paul wrote under Roman hegemony, a superpower who managed client states ver a wide range.

I don't understand what you wrote but, at any rate, Paul didn't teach when in the Roman Empire do as the Romans do. We have a higher ethic.

 

[asterisktom]

Ripped from the womb, poisoned in the womb, ground up in the womb, strangled outside the womb...

This blood cries out for vengeance, the whole world watched and slumbered and slept...

until a certain POTUS showed up.

Yes, like I wrote to KyRedneck, he has done some good. But that is not the subject at hand. Neither does his good American babies make out for all the Asian babies made orphans or killed by his drones and not-so-smart bombs.

 

[HankD]

Well it seems most posters are not fully aware (hope I'm wrong) of the gravity of this Trump/Iran issue.
Russia has yet to chime in.

I BELIEVE THAT WILL BE THE DEFINING FACTOR.

 

[Wingman68]

No, I am not under illusions that I am swaying the masses. I don't really care.
I am speaking my mind. I don't care what others say. Well, I do if they present reasonable, Scripturally based responses. But these issues are not up for vote. And the Bible is, and always has been, my starting point and foundation.

It is not something I just pull out. I have been waiting from response #1 to see someone tying the issue now with the timeless Bible which, Paul tells us in Timothy is profitable for all issues. Or did I miss something?

Let me just give you my take, you can tell me if I’m wrong. You have not served this country, & put your life on the line to defend her. You have been fortunate enough, through the graces of being a US citizen, to do some traveling of the world, at which time you probably apologized for us, telling those who would listen that there are those in the US (like you) who really care. You are just too privileged to realize, although you would not admit it, that those who fought for us, US, us, gave you the right to continue your wonderful life where you can be aghast at the actions of your president & say so without being jailed or worse. I bet you loved Obama though, heh?!

 

[HankD]

Yes, like I wrote to KyRedneck, he has done some good. But that is not the subject at hand. Neither does his good American babies make out for all the Asian babies orphan and killed by his drones and not-so-smart bombs.

OH I agree it goes far beyond that, neither are we completely sinless.

 

[HankD]

Another example showing the dangers of misreading Revelation as a futurist. Christ's Kingdom will never be superseded.

then the Iranian assassination was A-OK.

 

[asterisktom]

Let me just give you my take, you can tell me if I’m wrong. You have not served this country, & put your life on the line to defend her. You have been fortunate enough, through the graces of being a US citizen, to do some traveling of the world, at which time you probably apologized for us, telling those who would listen that there are those in the US (like you) who really care. You are just too privileged to realize, although you would not admit it, that those who fought for us, US, us, gave you the right to continue your wonderful life where you can be aghast at the actions of your president & say so without being jailed or worse. I bet you loved Obama though, heh?!

Boy you are so wrong. Gave my wife and me quite a chuckle. Thanks.

I was in the USAF, Minot ND. And I hate Obama. You are way off.

And, no, I actually talk up America when the topic comes up. But I also speak the truth about its faults. That is the very spirit of the America I grew up believing in. The freedom to praise or criticize. How about you?

 

[Rob_BW]

I don't understand what you wrote but, at any rate, Paul didn't teach when in the Roman Empire do as the Romans do. We have a higher ethic.

He wrote that the earthly powers were ordained to bring wrath to evildoers, did he not?