Prove it wrong: There is not one verse about predestination to salvation

[Scott Downey]

What do you mean? You failed to answer each of my questions. So best I can tell, you do not understand.



It seems to me you are making a false accusation because you do not know what you are taking about.

None of that has been denyed and so is not at issue.


That is just what you did by not answering my questions.
Romans 2:1, ". . . Therefore thou art inexcusable, O man, whosoever thou art that judgest: for wherein thou judgest another, thou condemnest thyself; for thou that judgest doest the same things. . . ."

Your in direct conflict with scripture, and arrogantly can not see that.

 

[Dave G]

This has already been addressed with Acts 15:18 & Proverbs 16:4.
Those verses are just as true and the others you quoted.

I agree.
If you notice, I posted those passages and addressed each one, in context.

Did you miss that?
Posts 73 and 83.

Alright friends, the more posts are written, the greater the testimony to the fact that there is no verse which speaks of predestinating a lost man unto salvation.

Why are you looking for a "proof" text, George?

Is there a reason that several passages ( more than one witness ), put together for what they say, cannot establish what you are requiring only one to say?
Should Biblical doctrines be established on one text, or more than one ( the more the better )?

Every word of God is a "proof text".

 

[utilyan]

UNBIBLICAL = NO VERSE.

You cannot, it is impossible, to build Calvinism from scripture alone, even if you chop out of context text.

Because there is nothing to bridge "you've been naughty" with "you can never be nice"

Or like here predestined to a purpose God has set to bridge into "salvation"

Complaints and ridicule will pile up.......but no verse.

 

[Dave G]

So you have a doctorate? From where?

Should it matter?

1 John 2:20-27.

 

[Dave G]

Is there a verse describing a man being pre-destinated unto salvation? And the answer is no.

The answer is "yes", if you understand 2 Thessalonians 2:13 in the light of other Scriptures.

One being chosen to salvation = predestinated unto life...
Eternal life.

 

[Dave G]

UNBIBLICAL = NO VERSE.

Amen.

You cannot, it is impossible, to build Calvinism from scripture alone, even if you chop out of context text.

That is how one does it...
From Scripture alone.

Although, if you wish to call the truth, "Calvinism", then that is up to you.

Because there is nothing to bridge "you've been naughty" with "you can never be nice"

Sure there is...
God's word.

Read it...
If you believe the words on the page, then you should be able to see it at some point.
That is how it happened for me.

I could bridge it for you from Scripture, but then as someone who has believed on Christ for the forgiveness of their sins, you should be able to do it for yourself.
All of God's children have the Holy Spirit, and need not that any man teach them ( 1 John 2:20-27 ).

Study it deeply, and all things will become apparent, in time.

Or like here predestined to a purpose God has set to bridge into "salvation"

Complaints and ridicule will pile up.......but no verse.

Provided, time and again, sir.

As for ridicule,
Be careful, utilyan...
You do that all too easily, it seems.

I encourage you to obey the Lord here:

Romans 12.
Colossians 3.

Here are the works of the flesh:

"Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are [these]; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
20 idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21 envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told [you] in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God." ( Galatians 5:19-21 ).

Walk in the Spirit, so that you will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh ( Galatians 5:16-17 ).


May God bless you sir.

 

[utilyan]

Amen.

That is how one does it...
From Scripture alone.

Although, if you wish to call the truth, "Calvinism", then that is up to you.

Sure there is...
God's word.

Read it...
If you believe the words on the page, then you should be able to see it at some point.
That is how it happened for me.

I could bridge it for you from Scripture, but then as someone who has believed on Christ for the forgiveness of their sins, you should be able to do it for yourself.
All of God's children have the Holy Spirit, and need not that any man teach them ( 1 John 2:20-27 ).

Study it deeply, and all things will become apparent, in time.

Provided, time and again, sir.

As for ridicule,
Be careful, utilyan...
You do that all too easily, it seems.

I encourage you to obey the Lord here:

Romans 12.
Colossians 3.

Here are the works of the flesh:

"Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are [these]; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
20 idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21 envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told [you] in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God." ( Galatians 5:19-21 ).

Walk in the Spirit, so that you will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh ( Galatians 5:16-17 ).


May God bless you sir.

You are saying the bible says it, but then no verse actually saying it.

Would have been easier if you just gave a verse that says it. I know you can't without the verse being explained away.

 

[George Antonios]

One being chosen to salvation = predestinated unto life...

Yet again, I refer you to the OP. There is no verse talking about predestination unto salvation.
6 pages in the thread and still no verse.

 

[Reformed1689]

Yet again, I refer you to the OP. There is no verse talking about predestination unto salvation.
6 pages in the thread and still no verse.

No, six pages and nothing YOU accept because you have this crazed interpretation of things to make them into something they aren't and vice versa. You have been proven wrong time and time again WITH SCRIPTURE in this thread and then you scream for cross references to dispute your table that is of your own wisdom and not Scripture.

 

[37818]

Your in direct conflict with scripture, and arrogantly can not see that.

You are the one who is in conflict with Scripture, Romans 2:1. What Scripture do you think I am in conflict?

 

[Aaron]

Alright friends, the more posts are written, the greater the testimony to the fact that there is no verse which speaks of predestinating a lost man unto salvation.

Creates arbitrary and fallacious conditions for the burden of proof, then bails declaring himself the victor.

Georgie is a Democrat!

 

[Reformed1689]

Creates arbitrary and fallacious conditions for the burden of proof

EXACTLY

 

[Dave G]

Yet again, I refer you to the OP. There is no verse talking about predestination unto salvation.
6 pages in the thread and still no verse.

Yet again I refer you to Scripture, sir.
You're looking for a proof text, when the words of many Scriptures all put together should be enough to do the job.

See Acts of the Apostles 13:48.
John 6:37-44.
John 6:64-65.
John 8:43-47.
John 10:26-29.
Romans 8:28-30.
Romans 9:14-24.
Romans 11:7-8.
Ephesians 1:4-13.
2 Thessalonians 2:13-14.

When I first read Ephesians 1:4-5, I automatically knew what it was talking about.
Does Scripture impact you the same way?
I don't think it does, or you wouldn't be asking the questions that you do.

This is my final reply to you in this thread.

I wish you well, sir.

 

[utilyan]

Yet again I refer you to Scripture, sir.
You're looking for a proof text, when the words of many Scriptures all put together should be enough to do the job.

See Acts of the Apostles 13:48.
John 6:37-44.
John 6:64-65.
John 8:43-47.
John 10:26-29.
Romans 8:28-30.
Romans 9:14-24.
Romans 11:7-8.
Ephesians 1:4-13.
2 Thessalonians 2:13-14.

When I first read Ephesians 1:4-5, I automatically knew what it was talking about.
Does Scripture impact you the same way?
I don't think it does, or you wouldn't be asking the questions that you do.

This is my final reply to you in this thread.

I wish you well, sir.

You didn't read Ephesians, you rewrote it, Assuming you were Always IN CHRIST.

The direct warning of Ephesians 2.....is to REMEMBER.

12remember that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. 13But now in Christ Jesus you who formerly were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.

 

[Aaron]

Alright friends, the more posts are written, the greater the testimony to the fact that there is no verse which speaks of predestinating a lost man unto salvation.

Read the posts and note for yourself, no such verse was ever provided.

Lord willing, we can use this fact in further discussions, now that it has been publicly displayed.

God bless you all as you serve him.

Georgie porgie, puddin' and pie,
Kissed the girls and made them cry.
But when the boys came out to play
Georgie porgie ran away.

 

[Calminian]

View attachment 3425 I ask you all to be as careful with terms as you can be. Our Calvinist brethren often denounce conflation of terms. We are not talking about election here. The thread is about predestination unto salvation. And please define terms with cross-references, not general one-liners.

On this, even the arminian would disagree. We are predestined to be saved. Romans 8:29-30 makes this crystal clear. We are predestined to be conformed to Christ and to be glorified.

I don't think you really understand this debate. The real debate is whether or not faith is predestined, not whether or not the reckoning of faith (salvation) is predestined.

 

[George Antonios]

On this, even the arminian would disagree. We are predestined to be saved. Romans 8:29-30 makes this crystal clear. We are predestined to be conformed to Christ and to be glorified.

I don't think you really understand this debate. The real debate is whether or not faith is predestined, not whether or not the reckoning of faith (salvation) is predestined.

Did you check the OP? Romans 8:29-30's predestination is not of a lost man unto salvation but of a saved man unto a resurrection body like unto Christ's. If the Arminianists disagree, then so be it.

 

[Calminian]

Did you check the OP? Romans 8:29-30's predestination has nothing to do with salvation. If the Arminianists disagree, then so be it.

Yes, which sparks my concerns about you. If you don't think justification and glorification have to do with salvation, I can't overstate my concern. You almost sound full pelagian. I hope I'm wrong.

 

[George Antonios]

Georgie porgie, puddin' and pie,
Kissed the girls and made them cry.
But when the boys came out to play
Georgie porgie ran away.

Ecclesiastes 7:6 For as the crackling of thorns under a pot, so is the laughter of the fool: this also is vanity.

 

[George Antonios]

Yes, which sparks my concerns about you. If you don't think justification and glorification have to do with salvation, I can't overstate my concern.

The idea, already discussed, is that God could have saved us but without necessarily also promising us a resurrection body like unto his Son's physical image. But God did in fact, in his great grace, predestinate the believer to inherit such a body.