Romans 9 and Calvinism

[Iconoclast]

MB reads what is on the page. He does not include the sin of adding to scripture. The reason you do this is because you can't prove your Calvinism.
MB

You read without understanding. Your posts are void of content.

 

[MB]

You read without understanding. Your posts are void of content.

OH OH That hurts.
LOL
MB

 

[canadyjd]

You are wrong tribulations are obviously secondary.
Rom 5:2 By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.
Rom 5:3 And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh patience;
MB

You left out verse 1 that establishes the context.

“Therefore, being justified by faith, we have peace with God…” The person is already saved. They are already a believer and have peace with God.

The following verses tell us the benefits of that new relationship with God.

peace to you

 

[Iconoclast]

OH OH That hurts.
LOL
MB

Try and make believe you can post as a Christian...

 

[kyredneck]

. . . For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Whosoever is not in the Greek text

it is all who are believing or all of those believing

16 for God did so love the world, that His Son -- the only begotten -- He gave, that every one who is believing in him may not perish, but may have life age-during. Jn 3 YLT

 

[MB]

You left out verse 1 that establishes the context.

“Therefore, being justified by faith, we have peace with God…” The person is already saved. They are already a believer and have peace with God.

The following verses tell us the benefits of that new relationship with God.

peace to you

Never the less we have Grace by our faith,. No faith mo grace.
The point is acquiring grace always takes faith.
Rom 5:2 By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God..

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Again in Eph 2:8 we see that Grace is still through faith It's always through faith.
MB

 

[MB]

Try and make believe you can post as a Christian...

Are you questioning my Salvation? Your the one with the ridiculous remarks accusing me of reading with out understanding. only the lost do that according to your Calvinism.
MB

 

[AustinC]

Never the less we have Grace by our faith,. No faith mo grace.
The point is acquiring grace always takes faith.
Rom 5:2 By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God..

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Again in Eph 2:8 we see that Grace is still through faith It's always through faith.
MB

I have bolded the statements where you are dead wrong. From those statements it is clear you have no solid understanding of grace. The apostle Paul speaks to your error.

Romans 11:5-6 So too at the present time there is a remnant, chosen by grace. But if it is by grace, it is no longer on the basis of works; otherwise grace would no longer be grace.

In Ephesians 2, Paul tells us, twice, we are saved by grace. The second time he says "saved by grace through faith which is not of yourself lest you should boast."

We are not saved by our faith, which moves God to graciously save us. But, that is your assertion. You invert God's work and make it your work, thereby nullifying grace completely.

Paul declares your assertions to be wrong, MB. Dead wrong.

 

[MB]

I have bolded the statements where you are dead wrong. From those statements it is clear you have no solid understanding of grace. The apostle Paul speaks to your error.

Romans 11:5-6 So too at the present time there is a remnant, chosen by grace. But if it is by grace, it is no longer on the basis of works; otherwise grace would no longer be grace.

In Ephesians 2, Paul tells us, twice, we are saved by grace. The second time he says "saved by grace through faith which is not of yourself lest you should boast."

We are not saved by our faith, which moves God to graciously save us. But, that is your assertion. You invert God's work and make it your work, thereby nullifying grace completely.

Paul declares your assertions to be wrong, MB. Dead wrong.

That's impossible Paul is Dead, You know I'm right and you can't stand it.
MB

 

[AustinC]

That's impossible Paul is Dead, You know I'm right and you can't stand it.
MB

Here you show us that you don't read what Paul wrote.
MB, if you won't read and accept what the Bible says, then you will live on an island of one.

 

[Van]

SNIP:

(2) “By whom, also, we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand and rejoice in hope of the glory of God”

Notice the word “also”. In addition to being justified (saved) and at peace with God we get something else. What? We get access to the grace that allows us to “stand” and “rejoice”.
SNIP

Once again "into this grace" refers to the additional information that we gained entry into grace through or by reason of faith.
You change entry into grace to benefit derived after entry. You redefine the grace providing justification into the grace providing endurance after salvation.

Your tradition makes Romans 5:2 to no effect...

 

[canadyjd]

Once again "into this grace" refers to the additional information that we gained entry into grace through or by reason of faith.
You change entry into grace to benefit derived after entry. You redefine the grace providing justification into the grace providing endurance after salvation.

Your tradition makes Romans 5:2 to no effect...

I haven’t changed anything. The Apostle Paul often spoke of Christians possessing enabling grace, after salvation, that strengthened them to stand firm during persecution.

We disagree, and I don’t see any movement here toward understanding the context of Romans 5.

Thanks for the conversation.

peace to you

 

[Van]

I haven’t changed anything. The Apostle Paul often spoke of Christians possessing enabling grace, after salvation, that strengthened them to stand firm during persecution.

We disagree, and I don’t see any movement here toward understanding the context of Romans 5.

Thanks for the conversation.

peace to you

LOL, "enabling grace" (AKA irresistible grace) is never mentioned in scripture. Yes, the NIV did change the meaning of a Greek word meaning give, to "enabling," but that rewrite is not found in lexicons.

 

[MB]

Calvinist always deny the obvious truth for the false doctrines they wish to believe. Like I've always said Calvinism is false and always will be. There is nothing they can do to make it truthful.
MB

 

[AustinC]

Calvinist always deny the obvious truth for the false doctrines they wish to believe. Like I've always said Calvinism is false and always will be. There is nothing they can do to make it truthful.
MB

Provide the bible passage of obvious truth for us, MB. Your bluster and prejudice doesn't make what you say true. Back it up with passages and share how the context of the passage gives merit to your theology.

 

[MB]

I have bolded the statements where you are dead wrong. From those statements it is clear you have no solid understanding of grace. The apostle Paul speaks to your error.

Romans 11:5-6 So too at the present time there is a remnant, chosen by grace. But if it is by grace, it is no longer on the basis of works; otherwise grace would no longer be grace.

In Ephesians 2, Paul tells us, twice, we are saved by grace. The second time he says "saved by grace through faith which is not of yourself lest you should boast."

We are not saved by our faith, which moves God to graciously save us. But, that is your assertion. You invert God's work and make it your work, thereby nullifying grace completely.

Paul declares your assertions to be wrong, MB. Dead wrong.

Act_26:18 To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

Rom_3:28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

Rom_4:16 Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,

Rom_5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:

Gal_2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

Show me where we are justified by Grace in scripture.
MB

 

[SovereignGrace]

to open their eyes so that they may turn from darkness to light and from the dominion of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who have been sanctified by faith in Me.’[Acts of the Apostles 26:18]

God does this via the proclamation of the gospel.

 

[SovereignGrace]

The KJV does it really good here as well…


To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

It shows that not only does God open ppl’s eyes via the proclamation of the gospel, but also turns them from their evil ways. Yet this will get misconstrued as FREE WILL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Iconoclast]

Are you questioning my Salvation? Your the one with the ridiculous remarks accusing me of reading with out understanding. only the lost do that according to your Calvinism.
MB

Your posts have no content, nothing of substance.
Can you show any recent posts that attempt to edify any believer?
What you are hurling out at Calvinists has no effect as you cannot make a scriptural case.
You think your posts are doing something constructive but they are more like a fly at the picnic table....no help at all. Nothing thought provoking.

 

[Iconoclast]

The KJV does it really good here as well…


To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

It shows that not only does God open ppl’s eyes via the proclamation of the gospel, but also turns them from their evil ways. Yet this will get misconstrued as FREE WILL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yes SG
Thank you for such a clear post.