What or who is predestinated?

Arthur,
It is fine is you do not wish to respond. You ask for an opinion then fail to answer, but this is a free country. By the way, the sovreignty of God vs the free will debate is seperate and apart from works vs faith salvation. I can believe in free will either by faith or by works. Election seems to me to favor faith, but these are two seperate discussions.

 

I think the freewill v sovereignty issue is another, deeper, layer of the same "onion" as faith v works. Both are soteriological issues. Faith v works deals with the means of salvation; freewill v sovereignty deals with the source of salvation.

 

And the root of both (free will and works) is pride.

 

Well, Mr King Arthur, he who always challanges others to give their view, where is yours, third call. Maybe your cut and paste option for historical preachers and theologans broke. Cat got your tongue?

 

I would say this is true with electionists, too. There is pride throughout any stance, dont' discount your own.

 

I hold to the same view on total depravity (spiritual death) as Anthony Badger...

 

Jarthur,
It is not appropriate for you to ever call someone down in this forum again for not giving their views. Why is it that wherever in life one goes, there is always one who points at others while being the most guilty of doing the same thing?

 

You changed the subject. I was talking about doctrines. You're talking about people. Electionists, as you call them, may have pride. But there is no room for pride in the doctrine of election. It is based on God's choice, and gives glory only to God.

The doctrines of free will and works give glory to man.

 

Have you ever noticed how often the notion of free will is espoused by worldlings ? Every time I turn around it comes out of the mouths of the unregenerate . It has even been the theme of movies by the unsaved . Shouldn't something so tightly held by non-believers give one pause ? I think mainstream evangelicals/Fundamentalists should stop and take a look around at one of their most cherished pet beliefs and see how much they join hands with the world in this regard .

 

Dale C,
I was giving views on here and else where long before you were thought of. He challenges people to give views, then avoids answers. That answers your questions. Why do you blindly follow him?

 

Whatever you say. You two are basically a clown act. You pick out a victim, Brother Bob your latest, and bang him back and forth between you two like a ping pong game for sport. It really gets old.

 

Hello saturne,

Well, well, well...you have spoken...

Just when you think you have ran off a Calvinist, you find out He is not gone at all, but maybe has a LIFE. Bummer huh?
Much to your disliking...I'm alive and well. As it turns out, I do like to spend time with my wife..and others. Not that it matters, but I also took time to study my lesson. Lets see what you have been up to while I was gone..

Most of the time I'm not this bold. But let me be very bold with you. You are wrong sir. The ground is not the saved or unsaved at all. This is very clear. As it turns out, the Bible is clear to what this is all about. I'll give you one more try..and Then I'll help you out. Deal?

Who said this is about salvation at all? BTW..add a J to my name. Thanks

I do not wish to respond? Who said that? Are you sleep typing again? I try to reply to most of the post address to me. Even when they play games like you...many times...posting bogus dcotrine views of atonement..."arthur atonement"..or some kind of joke...then placing links to bogus sites..that I click on. Its all a game to you. However, I replied. The rest of your post above is full of air..and pointless...and not worth a reply. add J please...thanks

King? I like that......But..no need to call me king. Jarthur will do. You can add the "001" if you want, but no need to. I'll let you use your freewill to do as you wish. I challange others to share, that do not share. This one post...one time you post and you think the world should stop and reply that moment. One time does not get it bud. But..thanks for that ONE. Give this man a star. Look at the rest of your replies. "hey Arthur...where you at arthur?? come on king...."

Its not about YOU. Maybe others have something to say. Maybe I have a life. Maybe others can say it better. Chill down...post your views..and I'll reply when I can. I'm not going to drop everything to reply to your ONE post that makes ONE point that is a wrong POINT.....when most of the time you play tricks and joke about doctrine. Sorry...not my game dude. BTW..I don't have a cat.

Well..i'll give you this. You got my name right. Now that I have replied I will not act as a child and think you must reply. I do ask you to reply when you can. But you are very wrong about the ground. Sorry...it happens at times. Get back with me when you understand the meaning...or you can support your views. Thanks


In Christ..James

 

Dale, there is no need to respond to you. Proverbs is full of verses about you. Arthur, without the J, you are wrong about the ground, and frankly, you have no Scripture to back up your view. If you think my view is wrong, back up your claim. As usual, you ask for a view, then give nothing in reply except cut and pastes from the 1800's or ad hominems. You two arent going to volley me back and forth.

 

Saturn....this is not about you. You post one point in 700 post and you think we need to stop the world. Get over it. Great..you made a point. Now..back it up...