1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Featured Election, Predestination and Scripture

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by Van, Apr 21, 2017.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Top Posters
Page 6 of 9
  1. MennoSota

    MennoSota Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2017
    Messages:
    2,727
    Likes Received:
    443
    Faith:
    Non Baptist Christian
    I notice you ignore 2 Thessalonians 2 when I quote it and you force only translations you like to be shared.

    Van, your deceptive behavior is noted and your untruth exposed.
     
    #101 MennoSota, Apr 29, 2017
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  2. MennoSota

    MennoSota Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2017
    Messages:
    2,727
    Likes Received:
    443
    Faith:
    Non Baptist Christian
    Why is it harder, Van?

    What form of "rich" is hardest? Are you "rich," Van? Is this why it's so hard for you to accept that God chooses by His own Sovereign will, apart from human works?
     
    #102 MennoSota, Apr 29, 2017
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Messages:
    28,745
    Likes Received:
    1,136
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Folks, if you think Charge-o-matic quoted 2 Thessalonians 2:13, I have a bridge for you to buy. He quoted an agenda driven rewrite.
    Next he questions the truth of Matthew 19:24. The charge-o-matics must rewrite or deny verse after verse to assert their fake theology. Just read you bible folks.
     
    #103 Van, Apr 29, 2017
    • Funny Funny x 1
    • Prayers Prayers x 1
  4. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    The problem is that neither of them actually support your position, but go against it!
     
    #104 Yeshua1, Apr 29, 2017
  5. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Messages:
    28,745
    Likes Received:
    1,136
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Wholesale deflection, and loss of reality.
    All they post is taint so, but devoid of any rebuttal.
    2 Thessalonians 2:13 proves our election for salvation is conditional, and Matthew 19:24 proves our election is conditional. According the bogus doctrine of fake theology, it would just as easy (because everyone is compelled by irresistible grace) for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.

    So we get absurdity and insult.

    Unconditional Election has been shown to be bogus by about a dozen verses.
     
    #105 Van, Apr 29, 2017
    • Funny Funny x 1
    • Prayers Prayers x 1
  6. SovereignGrace

    SovereignGrace Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 31, 2015
    Messages:
    5,536
    Likes Received:
    1,026
    Faith:
    Baptist
    What conditions did you meet when He saved you? You keep avoiding answering it? Why?

    Shoots your theological horse down.
     
    #106 SovereignGrace, May 1, 2017
    • Like Like x 1
  7. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Messages:
    28,745
    Likes Received:
    1,136
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Yet another repeat of the "what condition" question when it has been answered again and again. Pure obfuscation on display.
    When God credits our faith in the truth as righteousness, He saves us. God chooses people who are rich in faith and love God.
    See 2 Thessalonians 2:13 (in the NASB, NKJV, NET, WEB, or HCSB.)
    See James 2:5
    See Romans 4:4-5; Romans 4:23-24.

    Unconditional Election has been shown to be bogus by about a dozen verses.
     
    #107 Van, May 2, 2017
    • Prayers Prayers x 1
  8. MennoSota

    MennoSota Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2017
    Messages:
    2,727
    Likes Received:
    443
    Faith:
    Non Baptist Christian
    What if your faith wavers and you curse God when something goes wrong. Does God unchoose you?

    Is everything dependent on you and your faith? Is God obligated to save those with faith? If so, how much faith is required to meet the cut off line between saved and damned?
     
    #108 MennoSota, May 2, 2017
    • Like Like x 1
  9. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    God chose those baser persons among us to get saved, as while we yet sinners, Jesus died to atone for those of us who have no faith and cannot save ourselves!
     
    #109 Yeshua1, May 2, 2017
  10. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Messages:
    28,745
    Likes Received:
    1,136
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Remember the ad - "Where is the beef?" Did you see any biblical support for unconditional election? Did you see a "change the subject" question to suggest my view is not OSAS. Disinformation on display.

    Did I say salvation is dependent on an individuals faith? Nope - so yet another example of disinformation.

    What did I say salvation depends on? God and God alone!

    Pay no attention to these constant efforts at obfuscation.

    Unconditional Election has been shown to be fake theology.
     
    #110 Van, May 2, 2017
    • Prayers Prayers x 1
  11. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Messages:
    28,745
    Likes Received:
    1,136
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Do you see any biblical support for these bogus assertions? Neither do I.

    OTOH, we are saved by grace through ... wait for it... faith!! Thus our faith precedes our salvation and (per 2 Thess. 2:13) our individual election.
     
    #111 Van, May 2, 2017
    • Prayers Prayers x 1
  12. MennoSota

    MennoSota Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2017
    Messages:
    2,727
    Likes Received:
    443
    Faith:
    Non Baptist Christian
    Then you believe in unconditional election. If salvation is not dependent on faith, then God elects solely by His sovereign will, apart from what anyone does.
    Unconditional election. Very good.
    You, yourself, just made the case for unconditional election. Van, you are a two-faced person. Either it is God and God alone or it isn't. You said it is "God and God alone." That's unconditional election.
    But, you claim unconditional election is a fake theology so you call yourself a liar and deny your own claim that salvation is of God and God alone.

    Van, how may we help you find solid ground? You are being tossed to and fro in your own theology.
     
    #112 MennoSota, May 2, 2017
    • Winner Winner x 1
  13. MennoSota

    MennoSota Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2017
    Messages:
    2,727
    Likes Received:
    443
    Faith:
    Non Baptist Christian
    But Van, you just said...and I quote...
    Yet, in the top quote you say that we are saved by faith.

    You contradict yourself.

    Faith is not needed, but faith is needed.

    You are floating on the waves and changing your mind at every turn.
     
    #113 MennoSota, May 2, 2017
    • Winner Winner x 1
  14. SovereignGrace

    SovereignGrace Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 31, 2015
    Messages:
    5,536
    Likes Received:
    1,026
    Faith:
    Baptist
    James 1:6??
     
    #114 SovereignGrace, May 2, 2017
  15. MennoSota

    MennoSota Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2017
    Messages:
    2,727
    Likes Received:
    443
    Faith:
    Non Baptist Christian
    I would be taking James 1:6 out of context, however. James is in regard to us asking God for wisdom and then turning around and trying to solve a problem by our own rationalizing.
     
    #115 MennoSota, May 2, 2017
    • Like Like x 1
  16. SovereignGrace

    SovereignGrace Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 31, 2015
    Messages:
    5,536
    Likes Received:
    1,026
    Faith:
    Baptist
    The reason I asked if that verse was applicable is the being tossed to and fro, as I picture a boat being upon choppy waters.

    That's Van's theology. Its on choppy waters, being tossed to and fro.
     
    #116 SovereignGrace, May 2, 2017
  17. SovereignGrace

    SovereignGrace Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 31, 2015
    Messages:
    5,536
    Likes Received:
    1,026
    Faith:
    Baptist

    [​IMG]
     
    #117 SovereignGrace, May 2, 2017
  18. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Dead sinners have no saving faith within them, not can they respond to God apart from the working of the Holy Spirit!
     
    #118 Yeshua1, May 3, 2017
    • Agree Agree x 1
  19. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Messages:
    28,745
    Likes Received:
    1,136
    Faith:
    Baptist
    All the fake theology advocates have is absurdity. God elects individuals for salvation through faith in the truth.
    If God does not credit our faith, as worthless as it may be, as righteousness, does our salvation depend on our faith? Nope.
    These arguments are both irrational and absurd. And that is all they have. Just read 2 Thessalonians 2:13 (in the NASB, NKJV, WEB, LEB, NET or HCSB.)
    Again, we are saved by GRACE through faith (God crediting our faith as righteousness at His sole discretion).

    Pay no attention to all this obfuscation and absurd arguments. Not to mention efforts to disparage me.

    Unconditional election of individuals for salvation has been shown to be bogus using about a dozen verses. So they spend their efforts disparaging me and trying to change the subject. Same ol, same ol.
     
    #119 Van, May 3, 2017
    • Prayers Prayers x 1
  20. Calv1

    Calv1 Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2011
    Messages:
    360
    Likes Received:
    61
    This paragraph wins my prize for the most muddled amount of error mixed with eisgeses, wow!
     
    #120 Calv1, May 13, 2017
Page 6 of 9
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Loading...