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You knew what I meant. It was hyperbole.

bwahahaha... If I had my preference, I would plant a reformed SBC church (I like how they do missions). But that is funny too. I would admit, the SBC is NOT perfect by any stretch.

That was not really meant as an elitist thing. I am just giving you my observation. Actually, much of academia follows Sanders & Dunn who are much farther than Wright in the NPP stuff. And I can say as much b/c I daily interact w/ that academic world, especially NT studies. (I am in research...

What? That most "old school baptists" aren't all that good? I'd agree. Oh there are a few. But I really don't base my reading on someone's denomination. I don't care much for denominations as it is. I am here b/c I enjoy the BB & I am part of an SBC church. But where I live, I am an elder...

Is it not similar to dogmatize, "Calvinism is wrong" rather than "I believe Calvinism to be wrong"?

My guess is that you have read little of Wright. Very little of what I have read (my field being NT studies) has anything to do w/ that branch of theology. I'm serious, I can't think of 1 book I've read where I thought, "That is just his Anglicanism coming out." In fact, I've heard him talk...

I would only call the NPP "small" in baptist circles. But in the larger academic world, it is pretty much standard. That said, I know this is not a thread on the NP, and I tire of having to defend it from false claims. But when you say, "At its heart the NPP is a refutation of the doctrine...

Find a good church that cares about what you care about.

I didn't say it was a good source. I just wanted to even the odds. It was more of a joke.

Just to even the odds, here is a slew of quotes from a Calvie site giving the exact opposite. http://www.apuritansmind.com/arminianism/calvinism-in-the-early-church-the-doctrines-of-grace-taught-by-the-early-church-fathers/ Here's a goodie Justin Martyr (A.D. 150): “Mankind by Adam fell...

Some... but not me... I could care less. I don't even have a "version of choice."

Maybe I missed it, but did you offer some quotes and sources? That would be helpful.

Last time... you can't get it here, then I give up on you. The early church writings that we have, and I'm talking late first through third centuries, are not theologies. They are apologetic defenses of doctrines that the world was attacking. Things like the Trinity and deity of Jesus was...

There was no personal attacks. Just a recommendation to maturity. And if you can't see how that address the issue of predestination being mentioned til the 4th century, then take off your "I hate calvinism" goggles and try to read a second. I am going off of the extant literature we have. We...

Wow... really? Is that how you debate? You level the same accusation back to the person? "Nuh uh... you're the meanie." No words. I lied ;) I think your "lol" speaks volumes. The issues of the early church are for you a laughing matter. Quite sad really. Sorry, but predestination was...

How about you quote my post that actually address the OP? You have the gumption to do that??? You probably didn't even read it. It was back on page 1 at the beginning. I didn't pontificate. I think you should look up the meaning of that word. I was referring to another thread, and you know...

Negative points for saying "you can't handle the truth" but not going into a Jack Nicholson diatribe.

The issue is not presenting truth, but how you present it. Even Paul said to speak truth, but do so in love seasoned w/ salt. And since this thread has been reduced to cinder, I figured I would point out your pontification technique. It really does come off as pride more than confidence...

Yep... we do our theology in a vacuum, love to cut and paste, seldom study the Bible, unable to change "our" position due to copyright infringement, and are only "so-called" Calvinists. FYI... I wasn't always a Calvinist. I have barely read any Calvinist literature, mainly b/c I am in the...

Happy St. Patrick's day!!! :flower: